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"Profound Words"

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Profound Words
Wed, 13 Jan 1999 18:00:17 -0500

Firstly, there will be a meeting of The Seduction School on January 16th
between 5.30 pm and 7 pm, in Miami-Beach.  The meeting is being held at a
cafe on Lincoln Road.  The participation fee will be $10 and will not
include beverages.  During this meeting, you will get news of Seduction
School: one to one trainings, newsletter and you will meet other students.
For additional information, contact
Nathalie at nat***f@ga***.net[ ? ].

Now onto the e-mail:
Jason: (Commenting on "Well this guy leans over and whispers in her ear.
Ending of my conversation with her.") An appropriate response would be to
immediately lean over and continue the conversation by whispering in her
OTHER ear. Doing so would:
1. Neutralize her attention on the other guy - you've just upgraded yourself
to a similar sensory channel.

My Comment: There's no question that this is a good move if you are doing it
and one that will piss you off if it is being done to you.

Jason: 2. If she has any sense of humor at all, probably make her crack up
at the absurdity of a guy whispering in each of her ears.
3. Shown that you are a classy, humorous guy who can handle interloping
fuckheads with aplomb.
At worst, there is at least the psychological benefit to oneself of doing
something to stay in the game instead of just standing there feeling like a
pimple on a pig's ass while he walks off with her.

My Comments: As I think about it, if someone is talking right into someone's
ear and you lean over to talk in the other ear, don't you think this would
be a pretty rude move?

Jason: Rude to whom? You don't care about the other guy's
sensibilities, right? He's a fuckhead! You would be very rude to YOURSELF
let him get away with such a stunt.

My Comments: Granted the other guy is pulling a fast one but for you to now
try and one up him this way...well, I just think about trying to talk to
someone who is already talking to someone.  It seems like you are (a)
desperate and (b) someone without any manners (the woman supposedly doesn't
know that this first guy who started talking in her ear is trying to cut the
other guy (you) out, so by talking while she is listening to the first guy
you are just interrupting).  Maybe I am missing something.

Jason:  I see no need for you to do so much second guessing
upon the surface structure. The action I suggest would cut to the heart of
the matter, simply, humorously and without physical violence.
It reminds me of a story I once read about a tv debate between two
politicians. Just before the program started, the shorter guy asked for a
cushion to sit on, so that he would look taller and as impressive as the
other guy. Guess what the other, taller guy did? He asked for a cushion as
well! I like that!! Seems to me like a simple, economical model for many
competitive situations. It means you
don't need to memorize a whole lot of moves and counter moves for the
infinity of situations where someone might pull a fast one - just mirror the
bum!  In the case of the whisperer you would have only a
second to react so a simple, pre-programmed response is all that is

My Comment: I think another element involved would be the logistics of the
situation, how you were standing, where she and the other guy were
positioned, etc.  But I think having this in mind is much better than having
no idea what to do when someone pulls a shot on you like this.

Rob: (Commenting on My Comment that "Naively, I think that most women (not
all) are not hunting out men with money)  Well, if women only want you
because of your may not be a bad thing if you can bang 'em and
forget 'em without spending money on them....usually it dosn't work that
way.   I've had women comment on
how surprised they were that someone my age is quite a sucksexfull
entrepreneur, and have my life together so well.

My Comment:  I keep being told that there are a lot of women out there only
looking for a guy with money.  I guess they must think I am broke.  It also
reminds me of the story about Hugh Hefner.  When someone told him that
'don't you know why these women are all interested in you?', he responded "I
don't care why they are interested, as long as they are interested." (Not an
exact quote, but you get the idea.)

Rob: Which leads me to another thought that I have been pondering the last
few days....that of maybe appearing to have my life "together" a little bit
too much, and not enough of the "fuck it" bad boy attitude. Even the condo I
live in is spotless, and people continuely comment on how clean it is for a
male dwelling.  Which I think back to I think what was in F.J Shark's book
about strewing pizza boxes in your living room and not cutting your grass
ever again, and ditching the fancy sport-ute and getting a clunker.  So it
seems that having some bucks, and having your life together seems to do
absolutely SQUAT as far as women go.  May even be a hinderance, time to get
a Harley ;)

My Comment:  You probably need to make friends with a guy who is single but
of very modest means and you will likely see someone who is sure that having
what you have would be all he would need to have women lined up at his door.

Rob: I think we as males are entirely driven by sex.  If we haven't banged
her by the third date, then the unconscious starts to think this isn't going
anywhere, and your pecker starts losing interest.  Before SS, I know I would
put up with tremendous amounts of crap, just for the sake of having regular dad once said to me "Is the fucking you're taking, worth the
fucking you're getting?"  which of course comes from a position of not being
in control, and not being able to get what you want elsewhere.   That's
probably the coolest thing about SS, shifting the power paradigm a bit back
into our favour.

My Comment:  For some strange reason it has always been my experience that,
for me, if I haven't at least made out with a woman on the first date, it
usually goes nowhere.  I think there are only a few exceptions to this that
have happened in my entire life.

Rob: While I do have women friends who started out as friends and have never
gotten past the friends stage, for me, I think after having sex with a
woman, it has to stay sexual for us to continue being
'friends'.  While I enjoy being around those types of women for their
friendship, I equally enjoy being with them in intimate ways.  I don't
see the need to hang around a woman who just wants to be friends, in the
hope of getting some someday.  That's coming from TOTAL supplicator mode,
and I refuse to do it.   Most woman have no problem with being just your
friend after a relationship; translation : I like you, I like being with
you, I like you spending your money on me, I just don't like you in THAT

My Comment:  I haven't (yet) been able to be "just friends" and have a
sexual relationship with a woman.  This is, I am sure, my own limiting
beliefs getting in the way.

Rob: (Commenting on "An interesting website about (power)  is at which is on the 48 Laws of Power»)  It's a great
book, and has some great insights.  I especially love the Law about creating
the Fantasy for people....hmmm where have we seen
THAT before???  Although having to CONTROL women is not the angle of attack
I want to take with SS.   Creating an opportunity for an HB to be together
because we have fun together, and truely enjoy each others company, inside
and outside of the bedroom.  To position myself as someone interesting, fun,
thoughtfull, strong, compasionate, someone different than the rest of the
chumps out there.

My Comment: As I have said before, I would like to have as many tools in my
arsenal as possible.  And I am sure that knowing the mechanics of "power"
would be very useful in some circumstances.  There is an old expression,
which, roughly translated, goes "If you need a thief, you cut him down from
the noose."  If that's what is needed in the circumstances (and it doesn't
violate your own principals -- and this depends on how you do something and
what you do), then you sometimes need to reach into your bag of tricks and
pull out a rabbit.

Rob: (Commenting on introducing others to SS) .  I have many
other friends who I KNOW would benefit greatly from SS.....ones that
are in current relationships....being stepped all over by their current
GF's.....all because they think they don't have a's painful to
watch......but....I know most of these guys would never put the effort into
learning SS.   Besides, I know if someone would have told me about SS a
couple years ago....I would have just rolled my eyes at really
makes the ego deflate a bit.....and accept the facts and the way women love
to be talked to......I remember first reading the connection pattern and
laughing for about 5 minutes was way too "icky" for my old
"lets talk cars and sports" self.

My Comment:  My point was that some guys deserve to know about this stuff
and it is pretty cruel not to give them the chance to improve their lives
when it won't cost you anything and (as I did) it can be done anonymously.

Oscar:  I will tell you what a wealthy guy in New Orleans told me about
women. He is older and has been married several times. Very experienced. He
said that women want two things. Something that belongs to someone else and
second something they can't have. Based on that I've changed how I deal with
a woman I've just met. In the distant past I would tell a women I had no
special lady friend.
I thought that would give them the impression the door was open. Now I
handle it different.  I prefer to say " I am not available but I'd
love to talk with you a while".  "I have a lady I see regularly who
claims me as her own, and she's been good to me". That will sort of push her
away without closing the door. I say " I doubt anyone would treat me better
than she does so I guess I really have not
been looking although I sometimes think I could do better", and  "What do
you think I should do about that?"  I think you get the idea.   Anyway based
on the theory that women want something that belongs to somebody else or
something they can't have, that's pretty much how I handle women today.  It
is sort of the "take it away from them" that a good salesman uses.

My Comment:  Why is it that this strategy is so obvious and yet one that I
somehow resist fully embracing?  Tactics related to this interest me

Oscar: The realization that women are only interested in arrogant and
independant guys, while when asked what they want, they claim they want a
"nice" guy. It's for sure, when it comes to women, nice guys don't win.

My Comment: I very much enjoyed the little book "Nice Guys Don't Get Laid"
($7.95 from which echoes your words.

Oscar: When you walk away from a woman you are going with she generally will
chase you. But when you were with her she probably
spent most of her time starting arguments. Why did she start arguments?
Clearly, because she wanted you to demonstrate your superiority, strength
and indifference.

My Comment:  I absolutely love your clear, direct distillation of how women
are.  I think you are right on the money and it is almost identical to the
philosophy of my friend that I mentioned before.

Oscar: Women want to be told what to do no matter what they claim.

My Comment: These are the words that most guys don't know and if they did
know in whole or in part would be unable to repeat.  They underly a very
true but politically incorrect philosophy that I think is absolutely key in
understanding women.

Oscar: What it comes down to is that a guy must ignore every word any woman
says (pretend to listen of course) because their words will only mislead you
into taking actions that will win you nothing.   Just ignore what they have
told you they want, just do and say what you please and let the cards fall.

My Comment:  This is exactly my friend's advice; but it is a hard leap of
faith to make.  One that I am going to make because it is the only way to
go.  As you said in your book School for Scoundrels
(, it takes courage to
make a major change in your behaviour when you step into the unknown.

Oscar:  More will fall your way than struggling to be Mr. "nice guy".  That
has been proven to me ever since my New Orleans friend gave me the advice
that he did.

My Comment: My friend who does this also feels that once you make this a
part of you it comes easily and naturally and you can't go back to the old
"nice guy" ways. I almost feel like this is the quintessential advice which
makes my postings redundant.

cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.



One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.


Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):


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This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
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