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A WINDOW of opportunity
2/8/01 5:10:25 PM Eastern Standard Time


Could you make an announcement that I now live in Studio City, CA and if
anyone in the area wants to get together that would be cool?  They can
e-mail me at luc***o@ea***.net[ ? ].


GameMaster live from Graceland:
Hey Bro, well it's a fucking fool moon and you know what that does. Went to
my new hangout last nite where all the hot chicks from 21-30 are gathering
now. So Dave and I walked up to the bar where there were 2 hotties just
waiting. It also happened to be karaoke night...not my favorite night of the
week but I've found that people that come on this night usually have a sense
of humor. So Dave was between me and the girls and they sized him up
immediately - God, I love that guy. Anyway, I told Dave "Look I'm
just gonna start telling stories, let's see what happens" so I launch into
my book fantasy and start telling all sorts of tales including the "triple
play' story, after about five minutes the girls got up and swapped
chairs...GOTCHA! The one I wanted had inched a little closer and I knew I
had her. They had one of those menus with 1000 songs on it to choose from
and she was alternating flipping through the book and glancing in my
direction. So I leaned over, put my hand right in the middle of the book and
said "Mind if I borrow this...feeling a little.....impetuous tonight". She
nodded and slid it over "Thanks, I noticed you've been checking this out for
a while, see anything that
excites you?" She said 'I don't know, I'm not really into all this'. "That's
cool, I'm not really into this either, but you, isn't
it interesting how sometimes you hear a song and you just connect with it.
Could be a tone, could be the sound of this voice that just sends shivers
down your spine...and sometimes you don't even realize that that's happening
until you just find yourself right in the middle of this incredible new
experience that just washes over you and makes you feel really good." Her
'Well, I never thought about it like that'. I thanked her for the book and
flipped to my patented one song that I have been doing for ten years, and I
nonchalantly handed it back to her and went back to talking to Dave, totally
ignoring her. This was more
than she could take. "Well, did you find something". hehehe "Oh yeah, but
I'm not here with anyone special so I don't think I'm gonna share this with
anyone tonight". This was making her crazy and she asked what the song was.
"Well, I'm not a country western fan, but there's ONE song, that when you
hear it.....well, it just makes you...feel, ya know. And it's hard to
describe, or even imagine how when you hear this...well, I've been told it's
the perfect song." Her 'well what is it, will you sing it for me?'  Poor
girl, you are fucking history HAW HAW! "I don't know if I should do that,
I've only sung this to 3 women in my life and they all have restraining
orders against them (laughter) I'm kidding, but you might be surprised
at the response you have to the lyrics." Her 'well, let's go sign you up'.
"Nope....I don't share this with just anybody,
it's really very powerful and it's like when you hear it once, you just have
to hear it over and over again cause it makes you feel so good, ya know?"
She was climbing the walls, now her friend was tuned in as well. Both really
hot. And her friend who had been listening the whole time said "so is he
gonna sing to you or what?" Fucking women are hilarious, aren't they?  So I
said "Look, I'll tell you what.....I'll sing one verse, just to you, and
when you decide you want more, I'll let you buy me and my friend a beer and
then I'll give you what you want." Her 'OK OK---deal'. I was laughing so
hard inside I didn't even care that I was about to embarrass myself in front
of the whole bar, but what the fuck, right? So I asked Dave to slide over,
and I took her by
the hand and said "I'll sing to you, and I've reserved a seat on the front
row, and I want you to imagine we are the only two people in here" She
didn't know what I was doing but she got up and was just staring at me...I
held that for a few moments and said "up you go" and lifted her up on the
bar. It took all my strength but she was impressed...I think I tore
something in my fucking shoulder! She is waiting and has no idea what this
crazy person is about to do. I'm resting my hands on her knees "OK, let me
get in know it would help if you had a guitar" and she
immediately assumes the 2 and 6 position..."perfect......and then I began to
sing to her.....'well it was all that I could do..........' I finished that
one verse and her eyes glazed over and she said "Oh my god, you're gonna
make me swoon." Then I helped her down and said "yeah, sort of inspires
some...thoughts, doesn't it? But you shouldn't really want to do that." And
she was like 'oh no, that was awesome,
you have a great voice, if you go up and sing all the women are gonna fall
in love with you'. "Well, I'll think about it" and went back to my chair and
resumed the convo with Dave who was grinning like a cat. And Marty the
bartender who I've been playing with for a few months and flat out told her
if she lost 15 pounds I'd pay more attention to her was fucking PISSED.
That's the sort of the reaction I was hoping for because she's one of those
women who is really fucking hot and guys are hitting on her all the time and
she knows she can get away with a little extra poundage and guys are still
gonna chase after her, except for me. Anyway maybe now she has some
incentive to drop a few pounds. So the two girls next to Dave were
whispering away and didn't notice that I had left the bar to receive my
adoration from the other chicks who had just witnessed all this. I was
wandering around like I was looking for somebody and two girls stopped me to
tell me they had really enjoyed the show...they were both with guys who I
totally ignored as we just chatted of em' gave me her card. Now
guys, listen to this, this takes
balls. But when they invite you in like that it's OK to disappear on her
date and act as if he is "NOT THERE"....they will catch on and if you are
interesting enough, sometimes they will volunteer a phone number. I swear
this works and I've done it before but the trick is to get her to focus in
directly on you, and then do a takeaway. And if she bites, she may just up
and give you her number, or sometimes volunteer where she works...that's as
good as. One guy even stopped me and said "dude, that was the coolest thing
I've ever seen anybody do". Looks like I made a new friend in the process.
Cool guy, he's going out with me and Dave Saturday night...more bait for me!
Anyway, the girls at the bar were watching me work the room as they talked
to Dave and he was setting them up for the kill.  So when I came back to the
bar they were pretty much done. "Dave tells us you're writing a book?" The
rest was easy, Mary Beth called her babysitter to let her know she was
staying at a friend's and she also called in sick this morning so we could
sleep in. May have a new girlfriend, pretty impressive performance she gave
too! : )

It's probably worth mentioning that while on a two hour flight back from
Boston last night I was listening to Major Mark's Intro to Hypnosis tapes
and was totally in state. And, a full moon in a fire sign is always a great
night to go a little crazy!  Sydney Omarr publishes a great book with 18
months of horoscopes for each sign that helps you keep track as the moon
moves through all the signs and even has a chapter devoted to explaining the
effects that each on has on people. Women are very sensitive I've found to
this. It's cheap, about $6 at Barnes and Noble.

A footnote to last nites story. Mark's tapes for some reason always get me
worked up. I was on a mission last night to get laid. First place I stopped
in there was this AWESOME little girl at the end of the bar reading the
paper, short blonde hair and glasses...I was in love. SWOOOP! My friend
LouAnne was working and happy to see me...that always helps, you know. So
after a little chit chat I was trying to think of a way to initiate a
conversation with her...there was a basketball game on so I turned to her
and said "Excuse me, I'm glad you have your glasses, because I'm looking at
this (alternating pointing to the TV and back to me) and I can't believe my
eyes....can you give me the score?"  She looked up at the tube and read the
score. "That's what I thought....NC State....on top (sp).....shouldn't
happen, should it? Anyway, sorry to disturb you, it's just that I've found
in my research that people
who wear glasses are not only more intelligent than the next person, but
they are typically more open to meeting new people. Hi, my name's
GameMaster." Here we go. I launched into some patterns and she completely
went under. She didn't even notice that some guy (boyfriend) had walked up
behind her and I didn't pay any attention to him as I was just plowing on
ahead. Sorry dude, I'm busy mindfucking the shit out of your girl so back
the fuck off! He finally butted in and said "Are you READY to GO?" haw haw
haw-FUCK! Too late to get her number and she was embarrassed 'cause she
thought she was busted. So she said goodnite and left the bar. To my
absolute amazement, she came back in about five minutes later ostensibly to
ask LouAnne a question...but she came back to my spot. She said "I really
enjoyed talking to you, I work weekends and I'm usually here early on
Wednesdays waiting on my boyfriend." So I said "Yeah, it's too bad we won't
get a chance to continue this, he seemed a little threatened. I guess some
boys are intimidated when you make a new and interesting friend." Right back
in trance. She then told me they were going to the Fairview Grill which is
where I wound up last nite but I didn't see her there...don't know if she
caught my act or not but I'll make sure I follow up with her in a few weeks
when she's not expecting me!

Too much fun.


I'm from Hollywood/L.A., land of beautiful actress-types,
Defensive, Bitch-Shielded and Goldigging Blind-Ambition-eyed Demons.
I've seen Sweet girls move here and within 3 months develop all the skills
of their hardened, older washed-out, disappointed sisters!  You have to be
good - no make that great - to operate in these seas, Ross
and Mystery certainly bear testament to that! Hanging at coffeeshops, and
bars I would watch crash after crash of regular fellas and crash hard myself
even using heavy patterns, eye contact, kino and every form of takeaway.
Can't move away 'cause of the nature of work I do. I work in film, dress
well, drive a Porsche, look good for a heavier fella (230).  I'm ranting,
but I just want to expose the true nature of LA for average Joe's like me!
I think we get caught in an catch-22 whirlwind,of not scoring and
desperation starts to reek through our pores even with all the Jedi
mindtricks we try to pull on ourselves!



In your list digest mailout the following were mentioned:

Do you know anyone who actually subscribed to these sites?  Did the
offer anything of value that your list and SS doesn't touch upon?
Their advertising mentions that SS doesn't work compared to their
information (okay it's a slam from them to sell items).  If the
information is any good and someone has purchased it - I'd be
prepared to share some of the cost - only if the info is useful.


David Shade:
>go after the highly suggestible women IF YOU

Suggestible women are not only better in bed, they make for better long term
relationships.  (See Major Mark's "Building a Better Girlfriend.)
>But to say that the BRIGHTEST women
>are most suggestible is just plain false.

Scientific evidence is to the contrary.  In my experience,
the more suggestible they are, the brighter they are.  Not always, but most
>I can't understand why you would want to be with a highly
>suggestible woman if you ARE looking for a long term
>relationship? (I'm assuming that you are.)

Highly suggestible women make a LTR much more interesting,
especially if you're a hypnotist :-)
>These women aren't just highly suggestible to YOU...
>they're highly suggestible to EVERYBODY!!!

Suggestible women are only suggestible to those in which they already have
rapport with.  They select who they have rapport with.  What makes them
bright, or not, is their method of selection.
>These women are easily influenced. Period.

Suggestible does not mean easily influenced. You are confusing suggestible
with gullible.
>They will squander your money on every info-mercial
>product, Chia Pet and Encyclopedia/vacuum salesmen
>that crosses their path.

I think you're talking about the stupid ones who can't make a decision for
>They are incapable of critical thinking because
>they are so suggestible.

Critical thinking is a trademark of suggestible women, well, most of them.
>They are highly influenced by conmen and fraudulent claims.
>And because they are so suggestible, they make poor
>decisions. And this makes them a liability, in my book.

It is true that intelligent doesn't necessarily mean smart.  There are
certainly cases where intelligent women make poor decisions. But it's not
because they're suggestible.  Without exception, stupid women make poor
>Besides... why would you want to be with someone who's
>hyper-suggestible? (For more than one night, that is.)

Well, let's see.  I can make it such that she has one continuous orgasm for
the entire time that she blows me :-)
>Give me a woman who's more of a skeptic, but with a
>positive outlook on life any day!

Amen. But notice, most intelligent, suggestible women are skeptical and with
a positive outlook. They question everything. They also choose the time and
place and person with which they can allow themselves to expand
and grow and celebrate being with the man they choose.
>There is a difference between the type of woman who's
>imaginative and adventurous YET is still a critical thinker,
>uses logic and reason (granted, a rare quality among women!)
>VS. the woman who is highly suggestible.

A highly suggestible women IS a woman who's imaginative
and adventurous and (usually) a critical thinker and uses
logic and reason (and yes, a rare quality among women.)
Learn hypnosis.  You will begin to notice the ones with that
special look in their eyes.  Those are the ones you will go
after. The way I see it, suggestible women are the lucky ones.


(Commenting on Halbster:
"Tristan was singing praises for neg hitting and giving the
Her: I'm a model
You: Oh, a hand model or something.

If he is hooking up with her I don't think it is because of that
line. Really hot woman know they're hot and you can't hide that fact
with a line like that.  They just think you're a jerk, or maybe if you're
lucky she thinks you're joking and you have a good sense of humor.  I
remember once experimentally saying  to Linda (a physically perfect babe)
something like "you need to get to the gym more either you're gaining wait
losing muscle tone."  She called me on my bullshit.  She said something
like "What are you on crack don't you think I look in the  mirror.
Everyday I make sure that I'm physically perfect."  She was right and she
called me on it."):


Her:  I'm a model
You:  Really!!  That surprises me (pause) because I've known
lots of models, and you seem very different (pause and anchor the curiosity)
because it seems like there is something more to you.  So many of them try
to get by on just their beauty, and they're not nearly good looking enough
for their personalities.  So many of them get lost in superficial
appearances.  You seem like you can APPRECIATE SOMETHING DEEPER (subtle
fucking gesture).  You seem like you can think for yourself and do what you
want, fuck society, and focus on making yourself happy.  You seem like
someone yada yada ...

Here you're not insulting her.  You're very subtly challenging
her.  You are giving her a self-image to live up to.  You quickly let her
know that you expect more than just good looks.  You add some humor (not
nearly good looking enough for their personality).  You've also communicated
that you meet lots of good looking woman and they need to impress you in
some other way.  You're also giving her a compliment other than her looks --
she will appreciate what you see in her.  Those of you who did the hand
model thing can play with this a few times and report about your increased

(Mystery's comments begin): I strongly disagree, dude.  Your advice is NOT
coming from the field - you are idealizing.  As I am the man who brought the
hand model neg to the PUA table, I am also the one who put it to use first.
I assure you it is NOT an insult.  She will NOT call me on it like if I
mentioned regular anatomical shit like her figure or weight.  Once you
say the reply to her occupation, you may continue on into other
routines like "beauty is common" - RJ. You haven't TRIED it, you simply
assumed your weight crack was SIMILAR to the hand model neg.  A neg is
NOT a wise crack. So, arm yourself with the hand model neg next time
you come across a girl who suggests she is one.  You will be surprised
how quickly her bitch shield lowers, her self-consciousness raises and
her curiousity increases.  Give it a go bro.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Recently, someone was asking about strippers.  Most of what
follows is just a small bit about going to clubs because I don't want to
what I've typed in the past.  It is organized with 1) an understanding
people who strip, 2) approaches when you go to the club, 3) a seduction
method. One of the most important things to remember about strippers is
that they are people!!!  They are humans just like you and me.  What does
this mean?
Among other things
+Many of them are absolutely positively delightful in every
sense of the word
They are there to do a job and earn money.  Sometimes it is a difficult,
and frustrating job for them.
+Treating them with dignity doesn't mean losing your self-respect or
The general rules for seduction and/or dealing with people apply
+Just because she looks beautiful on the outside doesn't mean
that she is beautiful on the inside --- or disease free.  Many of them are
very fucked up psychologically. If they were normal going into the job, the
job itself can still mess them up. A large percentage have been abused
sexually, physically, or psychologically.  Often the abuse happened as
children.  Some of them are drug addicts, others are struggling single
mothers.  Others are living in imaginary delusional universes (usually, the
wannabe stars)
+They have good daze/days/nites/knights and bad in every sense
of the word.
+Although most strippers are very highly sexual, most are not
sluts and there are some very rare strippers who are virgins.  Yet, there
are enough who are sluts to justify being extra cautious.
+They have feelings so show some consideration.
+They (at least some of them) don't just have boobs they also
have brains.
Many of them are quite intelligent.  Many of them are putting
themselves through college,  sometimes even grad or professional school.  I
have the pleasure of knowing one who is now doing very well in medical
+Just because she looks pretty doesn't mean she is telling the
truth. Remember these woman have an economic incentive to talk with
+Many strippers are also very flaky.  The job tends to do this
to them particularly in certain geographic areas.  I have a friend who
has danced all around the country.  She currently dances in FL.  She
complains that she doesn't like to make plans with most of her dancer
friends in FL because they are too flaky, whereas in NYC they tended to be
They don't just flake on guys.  They flake on themselves as well.
****Sometimes the issue isn't her flaking on you.  The challenge is how do
you teach her to stop flaking on herself.****
+Many of them have their guard up around men because of prior
bad experiences,  and/or thinking that all men just want to get in
their pants, and/or viewing men as material transactions because they are
used to men paying and that is how they support themselves.  They also have
legitimate physical safety concerns.
+By and large they tend to be an adventurous, fun loving group,
with a great sense of humor
+Many of them are slightly rebellious.  Many of them could be
classified by NLP'ers as polarity responders or mismatchers.
+In my experience most tend to be more spiritual than religious,
and there are many who are very New-Agey, into Paganism, or the occult.

Mystery's Comments Begin:  Halbster, so far you are dead fucking ON!  I've
been with 8 dancers (my current GF1 is a dancer).  Very good shit - now ...
THIS is the stuff I come to expect from you, bro.  The handmodel crack was
pitiful, haaaa. *rib rib*

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
+Many of them are very into and open to self-improvement.  They
are humans and just like most other people, they have problems.  Sometimes
their looks are the source of their problems/challenges.
+Some of them are super health conscious.  They know that there
money is based on their appearance.  Hanging out at gyms and nutritious
stores can increase a persons general interest in health.
+Most experienced strippers have heard every line in the book.
YOU DO THAN WHAT YOU SAY!!!!  Sometimes, their truth filters are based on
one or a combination of the following...location(s) they see you at,either
the amount of time they know you or the number of times they see you.  Have
patience, use time distortion, allow them to see you come and go several

Mystery's Comments on above: I disagree with the "allow them to see you come
and go several times" notion.  I think it's a "one and done" sort of thing.
You # close or instant date them after closing or forget it.  To be seen
again and again is to be grouped into the REGULAR CUSTOMER thing even if you
weren't THEIR customer.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Don't talk a lot about yourself or brag.  Learn about them.  You can't buy
their trust.  In fact, spending too much might hurt their trust. At the
same time being totally stingy will also violate their trust.
+Most strippers earn money easily and spend it even easier.
Most aren't disciplined when it comes to saving.  I think there are several
reasons for this:
1) the money comes quickly
2) they see friends & coworkers spending, especially on fashion
and trendy stuff
3) they like to have fun
4) MOST OF THEM DON'T THINK INTO THE FUTURE.  They tend to live in the
5) They tend to be irresponsible.
6) They've never been taught how to save/invest
7) It is a cash business.
+Strippers are often challenged to have real relationships and
meet guys who can see them for who they are and get past what they do.
Outside of the club they have as much or more difficulty meeting guys as
Waldo guys have meeting woman.  I once was in a stripper's apt. while 4 or
5 dancers from TENS (one of NYC's most upscale clubs) talked about how
impossible it was for them to meet guys.  Part of this is the fact that they
delete most of the people who are just lusting after them.  Unless someone
captures their interest he doesn't count.  I think their real challenge
isn't meeting guys, it is meeting guys they want to be with.

Mystery's comments begin here): Damn, dude, you are straight on course with
this good shit.  We need to take this STRIPPER PROFILE and archive it with
my stripper rules.  Ask Craig about them and remove the redundancy.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Most of these girls don't care a whole lot how much money a guy
has (although some this is extremely important).  Many don't even
care much about looks (although as a group I'd say they care more about
looks than money).

Mystery: I lovingly disagree on this point.  I believe it isn't MONEY nor
LOOKS but ... SOCIAL PROOF that they want. They want to SHOW YOU OFF. They
would like all the other girls feeling JEALOUS that she has YOU.  So - if
you were on her arm and she brought you to the club's daytime
Christmas party (like the one I went to - the club was closed to the
public) you should be able to mingle and impress all the girls so they
later say, "your guy is AWESOME."  If you can convey that sort of
thing when you meet a stripper, you are good to go.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
+ Most strippers have a strong feeling about being touched/massage.  Some
hate it.  Some love it.  Observe them before they come over to
you so that you know whether to use massage as part of your seduction.

Mystery: My general rule is: NO KINO ON STRIPPERS.  Later at your house
sure, but not in the club.  AND - when they touch YOU, YOU act like you
don't really like being touched.  Pull away gently and consistently.
Remember, they use KINO tactics all the time - it means NOTHING to

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
+ Think about the parallels between customers and dancers/role
   * Just like many guys don't want people to know that they're
at a strip club, most dancers don't want people outside the club to know
that they're at the club.
   * Just like many guys think that strippers are sluts,
obsessed with sex, perverts, sexually dangerous etc., many dancers think
that the customers are like this.
   * Just like many guys think that strippers don't have
intelligence, many dancers think that guys that go to strip clubs can't have
brain in their head.
   * They sometimes forget that outside the club you can be a
normal nice guy with a job, and a family.  Someone capable of a real
FANTASIES**********  This is a great theme.  It is a common factor that you
share with the dancers.  They just have different wants, desires, and
fantasies.  Perhaps, her fantasy is to be an actress, model,

Mystery:  Almost always!  OR - they pick something ACADEMICALLY LARGE -
nurse, lawyer, doctor, architect or some other UNLIKELY occupation.  Usually
they SAY this but don't MEAN it.  Or they THINK they will ... once they
decide to go back to high school first, ha ha.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
I go with an attitude of I'm hanging out and having a good time.
I don't go with an attitude of I'm lusting after ladies, she has something
I want, or I gotta get laid and seduce one tonite.  I enjoy women and I make
no apologies for that.  At the same time, I am already completely satisfied.
I don't need anyone else, and there are plenty of other people.  I'm
hanging out with my friends.  If she wants to join our party she is welcome
to join it, but she is expected to be nice, and be fun.

Mystery: I try to stay less than 1 hour.  Like I've just dropped in because
some friends or to say hi to my friend the DJ (whom you don't have to
actually be friends with - they don't know)

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Very often if a girl comes around to me I'll ask her to tip me
before she has a chance to ask me for money.  I'll ask her if she wants to
feel my ass. And, yes I do shake it for them and flex/vibrate it : )  This
important because it accomplishes several things:
1) I have a good time
2) I GET TO a) save my money, and b) MAKE MONEY
3) I find out if she has a sense of humor and friendly attitude
4) It breaks her state, throws her for a small loop
5) I establish control of the interaction.
6) Gives me some extra motivation when I'm at the gym : )
7) I think a lot of them just have fun with this whole role
reversal concept.

Mystery:  Interesting but still, too many guys do this.  Attempt something
MORE original.  A girl will meet a rowdy guy like this at least once a
week.  This adds up to you appearing like a FUN but not overly original
GUY.  Notice how they will FAKE LAUGH as if this was the first time
this ever happened to them.  I like the 'throwing her for a loop'
though.  This is called ZIG ZAG theory.  She is on a program - a
conversation thread she KNOWS well.  "Would you like a dance?" is her
opener.  Instead of answering YES or NO ... which are the only two
contingencies in her interactive conversation, you should ZIG ZAG.
This means, DON'T answer her question.  Give her something completely
DIFFERENT from the expected ... "Oh, gawd, I'm not even HERE right now.
Guess what happened to me?  Have you ever seen the movie Willow?  You
know Mad Mortigan?  What's the real actor's name?  Val Kilmer ... yeah I
just had lunch with him and his publicist.  He is a very cool guy.
Getting surprisingly old though."

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
YOUR NOTE PADS BECAUSE IF YOU'VE BEEN reading this long you've earned a
special GOLD NUGGET, Scooby Snack Treat.

Mystery:  gulp

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Just as some people have written about stealing a woman's lines,
and I've recently written about stealing her behaviors YOU STEAL THE
for your phone number. How do I know I can trust you?  Your not going to be
stalking me or calling me constantly are you?  Will you be in a fun happy
mood when you call?  I don't give my number to girls who just want a friend
because they need a therapist to dump on.

Mystery:  This adds VALUE to the # because it makes it difficult for her to
get.  I do this ALL the time (unless in time constraint situs).

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
Sometimes, I'll tell them I'm having a rough nite and I haven't
gotten many tips.  I'll ask them if they want me to do a lap dance for them.
Sometimes, I'll tell them I have to get to know them better before doing a
lap dance. Other times, I tell them the first one is free so they can let
the other girls know how good I am.  And, yes sometimes they'll pay and
they love doing it : )

Mystery: Again, watch for the fake laugh - but if she's new, it's fun.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
BO.  This is very important (line stealing again) because it tells them I'm
not just another dumb customer.  Most dancers use a stage name.  I
understand this.  It also gets them laughing, gets them curious,
and gets their attention.  It also makes them feel safer with me, like I'm
one of the insiders.

Mystery:  Consider not saying your STAGE name is BO, just your NAME ... but
make the name VERY CURIOUS.  Later on you may say, "I have a secret ... are
you trustworthy?  My real name is Joe."  REMEMBER PUA's, don't ask the girl
for her real name.  It's lameass.  Just don't ASK for a name at all.  If a
normal girl asks for your name, she is curious about you.  If a stripper
does, she is trying to remember it so she can call you by your name and
increase the rapport to scam cash from you.  Make your REAL name hard to

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
My attitude is usually Fuck around with them and find things
that we have in common.  Recently, I told a dancer I'd seen several times
only chatted briefly with "My friend and I are celebrating."  She
asked me why and I told her "I just got out of jail."  She asked me how long
I was in jail.  I told her "Since, I was 14.  I went in a scared little boy,
and I
learned to become a man there."  She said "I know you're lying because I've
seen you in here before."  I told her "I stuffed pillows under my blanket
and I escaped for a little while."  I like telling dancers that we're
1) they always ask why, (gets them curious and hopefully a
little excited/happy/positive), 2) gets them friendly, 3) sets a fun

Mystery: How about, we WERE celebrating earlier because of X or Y and ended
up here for a few.  We aren't staying too long I hope.  This isn't my
headspace right now.  This doesn't look like YOUR headspace either.

(Halbster's comments continue, and Mystery's comments follow):
I will follow it with crazy outlandish statements i.e. Tomorrow my
friend over here becomes a Monk.  If you want to talk with him tonight is
Opportunity.  Then I might tell her that we took him here as a test and we
need her help to change his mind.  Do you think your up to it?
I like to make bets with strippers.  I find that THEY RESPOND

Mystery:  Challenges are good, sexual conversational threads are bad - why?
'cause they heard it ALL!

(Mystery comments on GameMaster's comments):
Cliff, this never happens when you meet a chick with another guy
and manage to somehow slip her your number under his radar....maybe two in
ten have actually called me. The five star thing just came to me last
night as I was thinking of an approach. Thank God he left for that 2 minute
roundtrip to the head. I've timed guys in the bar...if they're with a hot
chick they are back in 2 minutes or less, if they are with a friend, they
take more time. Anyway, the church thing....lends credibility and mystery to
the bad boy image I guess and opens the door for some nice patterning on

Mystery: I like the church thing ... I'm a humanist (atheist) yet see the
benefits of this.  Good stuff.  However, while this 2 minute window was made
available to you AND you seized the op AND it paid off, I believe strongly
that you would have had more chance by going into the 2 set and approach the
guy (your obstacle) instead of waiting for him to leave her for a piss.
befriending him you may ask, "So, how do you two know each other? Work?"
You'll find out what you need to know about their relationship.  Once he is
disarmed (hell, make him think you are gay and later steal a whisper to the
girl saying, "I'm not gay ... shhh" then continue to BE gay.)  It gives you
a chance to LEARN MORE, you DON'T make enemies AND you convey a more complex
character.  OH, and you also increase your chances of finding a WINDOW of
opportunity alone with her in the near future.  "Vanessa, let us girls go
get a drink ... I'm THIMPLY PARCHED.  Brad ... you THTAY here and guard our
THEATS.  Back before you can thay 'liza minelli'"


Ron (response to Alan):
Thanks for your excellent response to my post on Clifford's list.  Frankly,
you hit EVERYTHING right on the head.  I DO NOT recommend my strategy to
someone who is needy sexually, emotionally, spiritually or whatever.  If you
are needy you will have problems.  I did a lot of soul searching before I
did it, evaluated most of the risks I could think of (particularly with
respect to falling in love - which I really call falling in "lust") with her
(them?), etc.  I believe I have approached this with a some level of
maturity (only time will tell) and believe that there will come a time in
the near
future where I will not be relying on this as a crutch.

Interestingly enough after my first session with "Maria", which I will say
was nerve wracking because I really didn't know what to expect/do/feel etc.,
it felt kind of rushed and wasn't all that fun.  Interestingly though in the
days following, I did feel myself "falling for her" in the sense that I
couldn't get her out of my head.  However, I did catch myself and did a
second session with her shortly after - I was much more relaxed about it and
had a lot more fun and now hardly think about her.  I think it was more
being anxious to have a second go and enjoying it rather than really falling
for her, now that I think about it (self delusion, maybe??? - again, time
will tell).

I do know that MY progress in SS over the past few weeks has been great.
I'm using the languaging even in daily interactions with people, I do have a
female friend who I'm "sarging" for practice and learning alot about how I
say and do things, dealing with the responses etc.

Alan, I greatly appreciated your insight into the unintended conditioning
that can occur and will keep your post close at hand as a reminder.  I
believe you have actually clarified or stated some things that may not have
come across in my original post on this issue.


Max (More Jerkish Experiments):
For the past month, I've hanging with a 22 year old sexy and slim brunette
(BTW, I'm 41).  I was playing my usual nice man role, and was concerned by
how to take things in the direction I want (the bed room). What I know about
this girl is 1) She is rebellious 2) She is shy. 3) She needs sometime to
Since last Friday,  I decided to play the jerk role with her.  Here is how
conversation started shifting;
Last Friday evening we were out having a cup of coffee :
She: I'm going out tonight with my high school girl friends, I guess I will
be drinking a lot tonight.
Me: You are a loser.
She: Why do you say that? (she slapped my arm)
Me: You can figure it to yourself.
She started moving her feet back and forth, and then hitting my foot,
Me: Stop that, give me some positive vibes.
She:  I'm sorry.
Me: If you do that again, I won't sit close to you.

Sunday evening we met again.
She: I've colored my hair.
Me: Yeah, I can see that.
She: Well, do you like it?
Me: I don't know, you are always wearing black pants.
She: I always wear black pants in winter.  In summer only I wear colored
Me: Well, then you should not ...... GET CLOSER TO ME, cause I like my girl
with colors.

Monday noon time:
She is wearing red pants, which I ignored at the beginning. I was
patterning with her for sometime, and then an hour later I said;
Me: You are wearing red pants today.
She: Yes, do you like it?
Me: Yes, they look beautiful on you.
She: I did over 9 hours of sleep last night.
Me:  Yeah, me too. I don't like it when I oversleep, I feel like my face is
She:  Me too, I feel like my face is all buckled up.
I put my hands around her cheeks and started massaging them, she took my
hands off as I said in a friendly and confident tonality 'Ok, warm up now,
we've got a lot of things to do' [ When I'm advancing, she pulls back, when
I pull back, she advances, I could've neg her right there, but didn't. I
remember later to give her the big neg below].
This is how it went, half an hour later:
She: I used to be very philosophical about life.  I question religion,
society, everything....
Me: It depends on how you look at things, 'cause life is not fair.
She:  You don't think it is fair
Me:  Sure not, if life is fair,  how come men in their forties become unique
and distinguished, while girls coming into their mid twenties are labeled
(I could clearly tell she was hit) so I've learned that this is the order of
life, and I take it as it is.  It is getting so boring for me, don't you
have anything interesting to say.
She:  Yes, just give me sometime.
Me; Oh, I feel like leaving.
Suddenly she had a shift in mood and started to be utterly funny.
We spoke for another half an hour, I told her a story about my son, when he
would suddenly APPROACH AND KISS ME, it FEELS SO GOOD, as it was the first
time he DOES THAT.
As I know that she needs sometime to process,  I will wait and see what
happens next.
Any suggestions are welcomed.


Flyer (Commenting to Sisonpyh):
"For instance, I was having my first phone conversation with a 5'11
Elite Model today that I met on AOL a couple of days ago...she was trying to
act. . . . . "

Out of no disrespect for Sisonpyh, but did he actually meet with this chyck
after he met her online?? As cool as the internet is, it would seem to me
that no real HB would have anything to do with the web. Of course
one can see the occasional HB putting herself in an online personals like to the highest bidder, putting in her photo and all her INCOME
requirements for her mate -- i.e. simply a hot chyck using the web
for gold digging purposes.

Usually the chycks on the web are a fucking mess. My advice to those who
want to use the web: don't believe what any chyck tells you about what she
looks like until you actually meet her face-to-face. I have friends who have
horror stories to tell!

My Comments:  I have had both experiences -- some women are truly 10's and
others, well, they aren't.  I don't think you can just put them all in one
category just because you find them on the net.


Concerning OHW
Sorry.  You can be absolutely BUTT ugly and be an incredible PUA.  As a
matter of fact, you can use it in your favor. Let me give you an example.  A
few years ago I worked with a guy named Mike (his last name escapes me).  He
was about 5'6", perpetual 5:00 o'clock shadow and hair thinning so badly in
the front of his head it made him look gross.  He wore sloppy clothes,
smiled only for effect, walked with a slouch and was completely out of
shape.  This guy was 34 and had no money, he slept on the floor of his
bedroom because he didn't have a bed or any furniture.
Only of course,  when he wasn't at some other woman's place.  Oh yes, he was
an absolutely sleazy» used car salesman.  To top it off he drank all the time
and smoked pot.

Talk about getting women.  This guy could mind fuck like you would not
believe.  He had a HOT 25-year old steady girlfriend who had a decent job in
a credit union and a boatload of family cash.  Then he had another on the
side that gave him money.  This girl helped him buy a used Chevy Blazer
because his Datsun (remember those?) hardly ran at all.  I'd hit the bars up
with this guy and he worked every women who was appealing.  If they played
darts, he played darts.  He would plow right up to groups of women and start
joking with them and then go straight for the best looking one.  No fear
whatsoever.  He'd constantly approach women at convenience stores and
wherever he met them.  He claimed he never got rejected and he was right.  I
saw and heard women blow him off, and it was probably less than half that he
approached, and his mind frame was such that he didn't even hear or
comprehend it let alone care.   He constantly had women calling him and most
he let go because it was a giant game to him.  I can vouch for this because
I worked with him and women were constantly calling him.  He piled up the
numbers and dallied only occasionally because he had a good thing going with
his two main squeezes.  He still did a good many women on the side.

On one occasion - his two main squeezes plus one he was doing on the side
 he called it his "strange")  - all arrived at work to drop something off
for him at the same time.  Talk about  me and another manager being a
wingman.  That's about the only time I saw this guy panic at all was when I
had to run interference while he bolted out of the back exit with one of his

This guy was a total sleaze bag.  He was super manipulative to everyone.  I
even asked him why he felt he needed to manipulate everyone he met.  His
answer, "I don't need to manipulate anyone, I want to manipulate people."

This was five years ago and he even told me that I should be getting laid
right and left because I was good looking.  His girlfriend said I was
handsome but she could see why there were zero sparks in my conquests scored
department.  I was a master AFC and had NO sex appeal.  Being handsome does
not mean you are sexy.  Sexy is an attitude that you have and you instill
into the woman you are trying to seduce.

Once, when he was looking at his ugly face in the mirror I commented that he
was losing his hair.  He got a fire in his eyes and yelled, "Fuck you!
You're the one going bald!"  I went and looked in the mirror to make sure
none of my hair had fallen out.  I kid you not.

Well, we ended up firing this guy and I had the pleasure of giving him the
bad news.  Enough was enough.  Yeah, he got a negative last-second
disposition to go along with his ugly face; but in the end, he made it sound
like we were the losers for letting him go.  Even though he was absolutely
worthless, backstabbing, perpetually lying, lazy as all hell and a kink - I
actually missed this guy and wished I had paid more attention to his PU
methods.  He was a con man 100% but he had it and I'm still trying to figure
out how he did it.

Totally right-minded sort of guy.  He had no comprehension of numbers -
analytical skills zero.

The only time I ever saw him fail on a large scale was when he was
completely, falling down drunk.  Then he seemed to strike out all the time.
That's when he would blabber about how much money he was going to be making
when he started up his own car lot.

All said, he was a natural.


I've been asked for an e-massage.  Could you put out the word for any
creative writers to have a go soon, please?  I'm going to try to write a
pattern myself, as practice is the way forward, but I'd also appreciate
other people's contributions/efforts.


Has anybody got any tips, techniques or strategies for getting rid of
boyfriends, inparticular for women that have only just started seeing the
guy and are still in the "honeymoon period".

cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.



One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.


Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):


[all words] [any words]

This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
cli***f@cl***.com[ ? ] and it will be done.  If you would like to be added to the free joke list, just ask.  For those of you unfamiliar with the references to Speed Seduction»Â®, Clifford highly recommends your visiting  For those interested in seeing the previous e-mails that were sent out ("the archives"), they are available on request to Clifford or, preferably, can be browsed and searched at the archive at

By your accessing this archive, you understand that the information contained in within is an expression of opinions, and they should be used for personal entertainment purposes only.  You are responsible for your own behavior, and none of anything you read herein is to be considered legal or personal advice.  You also understand and agree that any products you may order as a result of your reading about them in this archive are produced and sold independently from us and that any complaints, disputes or other issues which you may have with the sponsors of these products are to be dealt with directly with said sponsors and we are not responsible in any way whatsoever for any issues which you may have with them.   If you are not in agreement with any of this, please leave his site now.

This newsletter and the newsletter archive in general is reproduced here with Clifford’s permission.  Visual enhancements and search features have been added by the webmaster to facilitate the reading and researching of the content.  The raw text as it appears here is exactly as it appeared in the original e-mail newsletter.  Products, services, or external web sites mentioned or linked to in this archive does not denote endorsement of those items.  The contents reprinted here are the opinion of the original writer(s) and are not necessarily the opinion of, nor endorsed by, the owner(s) or operator(s) of  The archive enhancements are generated automatically and there may be occasions where the visual cues don’t correlate exactly with the textual context; most of the time, though, the enhancements are pretty accurate.  The archive is updated as regularly as possible, whenever new newsletters are sent out.

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