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"All of this shit sounds like torture"

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All of this shit sounds like torture
2/21/01 3:08:15 PM Eastern Standard Time

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Those of you receiving this who are in Montreal, please contact me.  I am
thinking of starting a separate email notice to send out of events (and
probably scheduling some get togethers of people reading this who are local)
here that would be of interest.  To get on this list, just send me an email
(hit "Reply").

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GameMaster:
Hey Clifford, I've been reading a fascinating book titled "Ancient Secret of
the Flower of Life" by Drunvalo Melchizidek. Heavy, heavy stuff. Detailed
discussion of sacred geometry, ancient civilizations, origins of man, etc.
If you like Zachariah Sitchen then you'll love this guy!
Anyway, in Book 2 there's several pages devoted to transmuting of sexual
energy.  Tantra basically teaches the male that the physical orgasm
dissipates vital life force that cannot be recovered, thereby taking us one
step closer to death.
Apparently, the Egyptians believed that it was through this physical
release, properly channeled, the human orgasm becomes a source of infinite
pranic energy that is not lost, and will lead directly to eternal life.
Heavy
stuff.....instructions included.  I'm gonna do some more research on this.
Haven't tried it yet but it makes sense.

sc_b_2/105-8612994-9192733

In my obsessive quest to run down the revelations in Melchizidek'
"Flower of Life" but I can't find anything to confirm or dispute what he
says about the Egyptian method of transmutation. I have read the following
and here are my brief findings:
"New Age Tantra Yoga"by Howard Zitko: interesting book, long on theosophy,
short on technique. Lots of discussion about advanced spiritualism. Only for
the devotees. He does make one
recommendation for music selections during lovemaking, funny his No.1 pick
is Ravel's "Bolero"....was hoping for something new.
"Healing Love Through the Tao, Cultivating Female Sexual Energy"-Chia & Chia
Pet: for women only, for the practicing Ovarian Kung Fu artist. One
interesting story about how the ancient Chinese masters could drink a glass
of wine through the end of their dick!
Not much else for the guys but makes GREAT a conversation piece in
restaurant bars.
"Egyptian Tantra Yoga"- Ashby: Absolute hogwash, promotes a life devoid of
any form of sexual congress. This guy should be killed.
"Love and Alchemy"-Lee Lozowick: More nonsense, a straight sociological view
of love and sex. Don't fall for the "70 secrets of sex and relationships".
The only thing worth mentioning and this might be worthy of discussion...is
the chapter titled 'Secret 39:What women want from men' the text
reads...."virility may be attractive but it's not enough of a basis to find
the depths of her essential Feminine being. Soon she will need his essential
Man-ness as a
pole to complete her emotionally. But the second thing a woman is attracted
to is genuine vulnerability, or organic innocence. And what is it in a man
that truly inspires love-devotion, devotion that arises out of true
masculine presence, and inherent organic innocence. A woman that knows a man
who can surrender, but not fully, is a man that can give her total
fulfillment
as a woman."
"New Cells, New Bodies"-Virginia Essene: Metaphysician's ALERT !
Unfortunately nothing here about our favorite pastime but, if you are into
life extension and rejuvenation, or you practice the 5 rites in Kelder's
book (The Ancient Secret of the Fountain of Youth, aka The Five Tibetans),
then you may want to give this a peek. Channeled works and only for the very
open minded.

Hey Cliff, have we ever had a discussion of music selections for seduction
and sex?  I like cocktail music like Sinatra or Dianne Krall and Michael
Hedges, Van Morrison "Moondance" and "Tupelo Honey for seduction. For sex,
sometimes dependent but Enigma I&II are always a hit, Peter Murphy is good
even though he's a fag.  His stuff is dark and seductive.  My all time
sleeper is Alan Parson's "Tales of Mystery and Imagination". There's a
really cool takeaway in there that I had never noticed before but while
going down on my girlfriend one night she sat up and said "Nevermore my
ass!" Worth a listen. I'd be interested in hearing what the guys use as
standards?

FTI, I don't know if this has shown up before...$39.95 online exercise
instructions claim almost insane results!
"Guys, add 1-4 inches exactly where you need it! In only a couple of
 weeks!!! This program is changing lives of men all over the world!!!
Click Here ---> www.freehostusa.net/members/a938284
http://www.freehostusa.net/members/a938284
 Have a longer, thicker, harder, penis Guaranteed!!!, Just go to:


(GameMaster on clubbing):
You have to "integrate" when you're working these clubs and going in there
with an attitude of "I'm not drinking, I'm not tipping, I'm not buying a
drink, I'm just here to get me some pussy" ain't the path to success. But
then again if you are the best looking thing since Brad Pitt and you might
get away
with it.

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Bill:
(Bill sent in information on a couple of interesting products -- if anyone
gets these, please let us know what you think of them):
How to Live the James Bond Lifestyle is a serious 90 minute audio book
that will upgrade your life to that of 007 no matter your age or financial
level. Send $15 (includes postage) to: Ronin Audio Books 12335 Santa Monica
Blvd. PMB #116 Los Angeles, CA 90025
http://www.bondlife.com/
The author, Paul Kyriazi will give a seminar
in Los Angeles, on April 11, 2001 for MEN ONLY.
Call THE LEARNING ANNEX for information and
reservations. 310-478-6677

Dr.Jama Clark: 800-266-5741 has some interesting sounding books:
http://www.discoverycenter.cc/classes/il3620.htm
www.womenwant.com Meet Younger Women Learn: Where younger women go and how
to meet them Why younger women choose you and why they don't
What the HELL Do Women Really Want?
If you've heard "let's just be friends" once too often.YOU NEED THIS BOOK!
The book that finally tells the truth.

43 Things To Do Besides Go to a Bar
Learn where the younger women hang out, how to approach them, and how to
establish a relationship.

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Flyer:
In response to BGC's posting about LA chicks. I have seen RJ's posts about
9's and 10's HB's in LA and wanted to get a general consensus from everyone
about these types of LA HB's. There seem to be conflicting
reports.
This is just a general question: essentially it would be good to get all
bro's who have been in the LA HB scene to give their general short overview
of LA.
Chick scene.
Question being: Is it not possible to get an SHB (9 or 10) in LA without, as
one bro mentioned, being an entertainment industry mogul, millionaire rock
star, or coke dealer? Are all 9's and 10's in LA fucked up?? Is it possible
to get a 9 or 10 with all of our specialized seduction skills even though we
may have average incomes??  (For those of you who have asked before, please
refrain from asking "Why do you want a 10?", that's not the question here)

Again, those who specialize in the LA scene please post.

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Broadaxe:
>Halbster:
>Those of you who've been around Cliff's list, the SS list or other groups
>for
>a while know that I believe in seduction that empowers women.  I don't
>believe in being the jerk that women love.  I believe in honest,
>straightforward, practical empowerment that works by inducing wonderful
>feelings in yourself and others.  I believe that anyone can get great
>results
>with this approach.  The more I seduce the more I realize there is no such
>thing as a 1 nite stand.  Our communication and our behaviors may affect
>people long after we are gone.  Here is a story that powerfully illustrates
>how a person was affected by one date.
>
>Recently I was talking with a 31 year old attractive woman friend.  She
>dates
>a friend of mine.  She was talking about getting a nose job.  She told me
>that she is very self conscious about her big nose. This captured my
>curiosity so I decided to do some probing.  I learned that when she was a
>freshman in college she went on one date with some guy who told her that
she
>had a really beautiful face except for one thing...her nose is too big.
>Note, that I said "one date" because that guy didn't get another date.
>Before this asshole told her his opinion, she thought her nose was fine.
In
>fact, I think her nose is fine.  Her nose fits her face very well, and it
>has
>a cute shape.  For over 10 years she was made self conscious because he
>decided to use a neg hit.
>This neg hit jerk didn't know her full history.  As a baby, Lucy's eye was
>blinded and disfigured by an accident.  Children made fun of her calling
her
>Cyclops and similar names.  Despite this handicap Lucy managed to excel at
>many things, and made friends.  When Lucy was 13 she was at the mall with
>her friends when some girl about 16 started shouting "Oh my God.  Gross,
>look
>at her eye."  Needless to say Lucy became very self conscious about her
eye.
>Lucy decided to get her eye enucleated, but she had to wait until she was
>16.  The doctors gave Lucy a magnificent fake eye.  It matches her other
>eye.  People can't tell the difference.  Finally, for the first time in her
>life, Lucy got to be pretty.  And, yes, she was very pretty.  Unfortunately
>for Lucy she only  got to enjoy being pretty for about a year or two before
>this asshole had to go digging up her scar.  These are powerful tools.

The problem obviously lies with the chick, and not with the asshole.
Sometimes neghits are necessary to get the female's attention. Jeez, this
chick is 31 years old, and she takes what one guy says so seriously? She
needs to grow up. Think about all the verbal abuse us men have taken in our
PU attempts. You have to just dismiss it and move on. Are women that much
different than men? If she is so messed up in her head that she can't
dismiss that insult for what it was, then she deserves all the pain that she
gets. It may seem cruel, but that's the way things are.

I want to ask some older, seasoned PUA's a question about social status. I'm
almost 23, almost graduated from college, and I'm thinking about career
paths to take. How important is having a lot of money as far as social
circles go? Do you feel that you are ostracized sometimes for not having a
lot of money, even though you have a lot of charm and appeal? Anyone can
feel free to share your opinion.

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Jake:
> Optimus:
> Because it seems to me, that if you can create the belief in her mind
that;
> you = famous (or the feelings/effects/states of being famous)
> you = rich (or the feelings/effects/states of being famous)
> even if it's totally not true at all...then your expectation for getting
> your desired outcome will skyrocket. Huge shortcut. And if there can be a
> way to do it FAST...hmm....
>
> My Comment: I think you have hit an important nail on the head and I would
> like to hear from everyone with ideas about this.

Creating a belief sounds like too much work.
FWIW, this what I'd suggest:
1. Find out what  being with a guy who's rich &/or famous makes her
feel.
2. Have her remember a time when she's felt that way and anchor it to
being with you.
3. Get her to intensify those feelings, anchor those intensified
feelings to being with you, then do a take away.
4. Repeat step 3 until she jumps you.

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Max:
> Halbster:
> Those of you who've been around Cliff's list, the SS list or other groups
> for
> a while know that I believe in seduction that empowers women. I don't
> believe in being the jerk that women love. I believe in honest,
> straightforward, practical empowerment that works by inducing wonderful
> feelings in yourself and others. I believe that anyone can get great
> results
> with this approach. The more I seduce the more I realize there is no such
> thing as a 1 nite stand. Our communication and our behaviors may affect
> people long after we are gone.

I'm glad that you have figured your way around in the game.
I have been experimenting with jerkish stuff lately, and it is working well
so far, though I haven't closed yet.  I agree with you in part about what
you wrote. Negging any part of someone's physique is BAD and WRONG, it may
cause long term damage. I won't also neg on something expensive that a woman
might have (i.e. Car, Furniture, ....) . I have no second opinion about that
issue.  What I do usually is negging on little items, like an ear ring,
color of
pants, color of manicure..... something that can be changed with no or
minimal
cost.  I do have a good respect for your opinion and thoughts.

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Marc:
> Optimus:
> How can we steal all the "things" that "being famous" does for a woman?

It seems to me that whenever I see and recognize a famous person, regardless
of whether I like that person or not, something in my brain switches. It's
just
the recognition that does something to my mind that causes me to change my
state of mind. In other words, I enter an altered state, a trance. That
wouldn't be helpful?

Another benefit of being famous is that a lot of women will have formed a
(romantic) image in her mind of that famous person, because of endless
exposure to video clips, films, TV-shows, magazines, etc. This has two major
benefits. One, women will approach that famous person, hence the roles are
reversed. He's unique. He's the prize from the start due to scarcity. Two,
he can be laid-back, cool or whatever, because he doesn't need to impress
her. This coolness adds to the challenge and his perceived confidence,
making him more attractive still.

As to your question how to utilize this phenomenon, I am not sure. How about
suddenly saying "Look, it's Bill Clinton!!"  whilst pointing to yourself? Or
otherwise find out what famous person in particular she finds attractive,
elicit those feelings and values, and mirror it back to her by talking about
Mr. X and pointing to self.
I hope someone can pick something from this and run away with it.

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Max:
A few days ago I was with Clifford, and I was telling him about an encounter
that took place between me and an attractive bartender (I've posted the
details a few weeks back, but I'm posting it again below)

Clifford told me that he knows that once I get such a response as the one I
got, I should be able to lead to a close.  A strong response, whether
positive or negative, could be turned into something.

=> My questions, what strategy would be effective from where I left off, to
lead to a close?

The bartender was an attractive blond that everybody was hitting on. She
seemed to be dynamic behind the bar, and was 'displaying' a lot of
confidence.  I ordered my 'Corona' and waited for the moment when she was
not busy, as she let up a cigarette and passed across me on the other side
of the counter;
Me: How long have you been working here?
She: I've worked here as a waitress for a year, and I've been a bartender
for about two weeks.
Me: You seem to be comfortable at your stage, and, despite those big ear
rings you are wearing, I see that you are dynamic and move with ease.

=> My strategy is to deal two cards, a neg one and a positive one, and see
which card she draws.

She: Oh, you don't like my ear rings?

=> She drew the neg card.

Me: Yes, I don't . (true, I didn't like them and I thought they were too
big)

At this moment, she leaned forward toward me (she was fully erect while
talking to others)

She: Those are the biggest I've got. It is the first time I wear them.
Me: I see that a smaller set would allow more exposure to your face. By the
way, let me ask you this; a lot of people seem to talk with you around here,
how do you differentiate between those who are trying to pick you up
(Pointing far to the right) and those who really want to get to know you
(SP)?
She:  Ummm, I guess I don't care.
At that moment, she was called by another bartender, and she said 'Stay
here, I'll be right back' .  I then said "I've to go now, see you."

=> I could have stayed if I knew the strategy to follow from where I left
off, or from the time where she responded to my neg.  Ideas?

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Tristan:
A friend of mine who is very good with the ladies told me his boldest
approach. He was in a bar, some moron was boring and annoying the shit out
of an HB. After observing the situation and giving her knowing smiles and
looks, he walks over to her (remember, he had never seen, spoken, or talked
to her before) casually puts his hand on her shoulder and whispers into her
ear: Would you like me to get rid of this guy for you?'' ''You could do
that?'' she answers. ''Yes'' he says and leans over and plants a massive
kiss right on her lips. The moron, just stood there completely shocked, then
walks away with his tail between his legs.  She looks at my buddy completely
stunned, but yet totally grateful. He just says: ''You're welcome'' and
walks away. The only thing I wonder is why the hell he didn't pursue it. I
have no doubt he would have seduced her without breaking a sweat. I'm
waiting for the opportunity to try that one myself...

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Halbster:
Here is a clip from a recent IM dialogue with someone who I've been seeing
for over a year. I clipped this to help illustrate the art of fluffing.
More importantly, this dialogue illustrates how to turn a boring, mundane
routine experience into something more interesting. It is also a good
example of the way that I typically communicate, and I have communicated for
as long as I can remember. I logged on specifically to find her and invite
her to immediately log off and do something with me. Bold faced
Paretheticals
a"( )" are comments that I added for this list, but she did not receive.
Halbster: Hello
Halbster: You've been selected!!! (Gets curiosity)
Halbster: Congratulations!!! (Word is a positive anchor for most people)
Halbster: HER Team is inviting you to participate in the challenge
Halbster: It is a Survivor like Reality based challenge
Halbster: HER Team after a careful screening believes that you are an
appropriate candidate, and hopes that you will accept this great challenge
(Sets a challenge)
Halbster: It is HER Team's belief that you will find the challenge to be
an exciting, delightful, and rewarding experience. (Sets a frame)
HB: ???
Halbster: The Horny Erotic Response Team would like to invite you to
participate in the DRIP Challenge (humor, and additional frame setting)
HB: LOL...LOL
Halbster: Dry Relief In Panties
HB: lol
Halbster: The rules of the challenge involve: (I am now the one setting
rules, and I've framed it in a way so that she wants to play along)
HB: ok...
Halbster: 1) Attending a movie
HB: ok
HB: any particular type of movie?
Halbster: 2) Your movie companion will be Mr. Halbster, Esq. A.K.A The
Wetter, SCUBA Mike, The Iron Brief Man
HB: lol...lol
HB: ok
Halbster: 3) The challenge will be to see how long you can keep your
panties dry
HB: yeah...right....depends on the movie and if my escort is going to
keep his appendages to himself
Halbster: 4) It is your escort's responsibility to make this a challenge
for you
Halbster: 5) Tonite's movie selection will be the Tiger movie.
HB: I already lost.... just the thought of the challenge makes me wet
HB: And what is the Tiger movie about???
Halbster: Some HER Team rebels play a different game. "Can I keep my
panties wet through the whole movie" (I like to give people challenges, yet
successful experiences)
HB: Oh, that's easy...I'll win that
Halbster: Because HER Team takes pride in rigorous, vigorous challenge
BenWaaaaaaaahhhhhh Balls will not be permitted during the event. It must be
accomplished by using abilities that already exist completely within you
HB: lol...lol... ohhhhh...I can't use my aids
HB: or any toys???
Halbster: Aids and Toys of exceptional creativity will be rewarded.
However, they must be submitted to the HER Team for approval.
HB: lol
HB: This looks interesting....did u really want to see it tonight?
Halbster: No. I was just pretending. I am a movie-watcher wannabe. Yes,
I do want to see it.
HB: Tonight?
HB: Crouching Tiger
Hidden Dragon
Halbster: My virus paranoia tells me that if I click on that web site I
might be tricked and get a virus. I could be tricked by either a very smart
virus program that picks out key words and slips them in as apparently
innocent hyperlinks sent by a friend, or by the secret Sinister HB, but I am
feeling wild and reckless tonite. (no, that was not intended as a setup for
anal sex later in the nite ; )
HB: Go for it
Halbster: I am going to click after I do my virus vanquishing/vanishing
ritual. Virus be Damned!!!! (The above is mainly humor with her making fun
of my own extreme paranoia about computer viruses. Incidentally, a person's
attitude and caution here MIGHT be metaphoric and a signal about how
cautious they are about other types of viruses, i.e. STDs.)
HB: lol
HB: ommmmmmmmmmmmmmm
Halbster: "Go for it" just what the virus installers would want me to do.
Exactly what they'd say.
HB: The only difference is that I don't own a virus debugging software
company
Halbster: I shall meditate on the peacefulness of a pool of carrot juice
(inside joke) and click my heels (Pilates penguin style of course), and all
shall be swell.
(I highly recommend Pilates based workouts)

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Sisonpyh:
(Responding to a request of mine to elaborate on how he gets women to be
begging for sex):
You know, Cliff... the funny thing about this is that it really originated
in a conversation you and I had a few years ago.  We were talking one night,
and you told me that you liked to get women worked up on the telephone so
they're all hot and bothered with voice and sensual talk, etc.
Of course, this made me go home and ask myself "How the hell do you DO
THAT?"
So I worked on this one for a long time, brainstormed about it, and figured
out how to get women worked up on the phone by talking about cuddling,
kissing, etc. to the point where they say "I'm starting to get turned on"
etc... this was a natural extension of that conversation with you, my man.
To answer the 'How do you make a woman beg you to have sex with her?'
question, I'm going to reprint a section that I wrote earlier, and add a bit
to it. Here's what I said in my original post:
"I have personally always liked the way women smell.  So when she's laying
next to me with me stroking her hair, I begin to smell her shoulders.  Just
a
little at first, and then more and more, while stroking her hair. Within
about 5 or 10 minutes, I'm smelling her neck and ears.  No kissing, and no
groping at all. Never! I'm just smelling, then leaning back and acting like
I'm completely enjoying the smelling, and it's relaxing me. Try this, my
friends.  If you can keep on smelling, she'll get so turned on that you
won't
believe it! At some point she'll try to kiss me, which is what I'm waiting
for. I will let her lips get close to mine, even touch just a teensy bit
and then I'll back away. And keep smelling. I might say "Oh, you're kind of
forward".  Love it. After a few of these, I'll kiss her, and run my hands
through her hair.   The whole romantic kiss thing, then, again, I'll stop. I
personally like it when a woman is pleading with me to make love to her.
Which I can do almost every time (Please don't take this as bragging, which
it surely is. But I'm serious. It's damn fun.)"
And here are a couple of how to's for the beg me routine:
1) When I'm kissing and making out with the girl, as soon as it starts to
get a little heavy, I'll stop and whisper in her ear "I'm not going to sleep
with you tonight..." then I'll pause and say "You're going to have to beg me
if you want it."
At this point, the girl usually scoffs or laughs at me and says "Yeah,
right.
I'm not going to beg you."
OK, admittedly this is a little ballsy and requires complete fucking faith
in what you're doing. You can't half-ass this one, because she'll pick up on
it immediately and you really won't be sleeping with her tonight. But if you
say it with conviction, and you don't act like a pussy when she scoffs or
laughs or acts fake offended, you might get a surprise...
Anyways, when I've done it in the past (many times) we'll usually start the
kissing again... and then I'll be very patient and just keep making out with
her... but not overtly touching her sexually.
I'm waiting for her to start doing something that is sexual... for instance
grinding her hips on me... or grabbing my ass... whatever.
When I'm patient, the chick will usually do something that is subtly sexual
FIRST. This is key, as she's then the aggressor....
Then I do a little verbal move and say "All you have to do is say PLEASE."
I'm laughing as I write this... damn, this is great.
So the first time, she'll say "No, no, no... I'm not going to beg you..."
and
I just say "OK"...
Then I roll over or just lay back and look up... away from her. This usually
makes the chick begin to wonder what the fuck is going on, and come over and
start cuddling, kissing, etc. me again.
I keep on with the sensual kissing, breathing in her ears... all that good
stuff... and when she gets worked up again and I hear her breathing get
faster, heart rate increase, etc. I just say "All you have to do is say
PLEASE..."
OK, you get the idea... I keep doing this until she says "OK OK, please...
please..."
Last time I did this, when she said 'PLEASE' I said back to her "Um, no...
you made me wait too long, so now you have to wait..."
The funny part is, even though all of this shit sounds like torture in
writing, women LOVE IT!
All of the most extreme sounding things that I've written, when presented in
a cocky and funny way are like a woman's ultimate dream live.
Go and make them beg... it's damn fun.

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Thranduil:
> Halbster:
> Those of you who've been around Cliff's list, the SS list or other groups
> for
> a while know that I believe in seduction that empowers women. I don't
> believe in being the jerk that women love. I believe in honest,
> straightforward, practical empowerment that works by inducing wonderful
> feelings in yourself and others. I believe that anyone can get great
> results with this approach.

I partially agree with you, but the problem with your approach is that it
doesn't work with super HB's or extremely confident women. The reason is
that they already have all the power, because they are used to it. The other
men always give them this power. You can't empower them because in their
mind, they have more power than you. The neg is useful in cases like that.
With a neg, you get her to fall down from her pedestal and realize that you
are different and have more power than other men and her... Personally, I
only use neg hits on women who obviously think that they have the power over
me, to show them that they are wrong. In all other situations, negs are not
useful.
> The more I seduce the more I realize there is no such
> thing as a 1 nite stand. Our communication and our behaviors may affect
> people long after we are gone. Here is a story that powerfully illustrates
> how a person was affected by one date.
>
> Recently I was talking with a 31 year old attractive woman friend. She
> dates
> a friend of mine. She was talking about getting a nose job. She told me
> that she is very self conscious about her big nose. This captured my
> curiosity so I decided to do some probing. I learned that when she was a
> freshman in college she went on one date with some guy who told her that
she
> had a really beautiful face except for one thing...her nose is too big.
> Note, that I said "one date" because that guy didn't get another date.
> Before this asshole told her his opinion, she thought her nose was fine.
In
> fact, I think her nose is fine. Her nose fits her face very well, and it
> has
> a cute shape. For over 10 years she was made self conscious because he
> decided to use a neg hit.

The problem in your story is that this is not a neg hit. This is an insult.
A neg hit should be reserved for HB's, and never be about her body or about
something she is not responsible for (or so she thinks), ex: nose, breast
size, weight... Because by doing so you are directly attacking her. A good
neg could be, for example, about her hair cut, fingernail coloring, shoes,
some of her clothes, something stupid or funny she said... In that case this
is not her that you criticize but something she did or has. You are not
attacking what she is but what she does and this is the whole difference.
I agree with you, the guy of your story is an asshole (or a stupid guy, but
he
is not a seducer).
> This neg hit jerk didn't know her full history. As a baby, Lucy's eye was
> blinded and disfigured by an accident. Children made fun of her calling
her
> Cyclops and similar names. Despite this handicap Lucy managed to excel at
> many things, and made friends. When Lucy was 13 she was at the mall with
> her friends when some girl about 16 started shouting "Oh my God. Gross,
> look
> at her eye." Needless to say Lucy became very self conscious about her
eye.
> Lucy decided to get her eye enucleated, but she had to wait until she was
> 16. The doctors gave Lucy a magnificent fake eye. It matches her other
> eye. People can't tell the difference. Finally, for the first time in her
> life, Lucy got to be pretty. And, yes, she was very pretty. Unfortunately
> for Lucy she only got to enjoy being pretty for about a year or two before
> this asshole had to go digging up her scar. These are powerful tools.

It is why a neg hit should never be about something she can't change. The
goal is not to destroy the girl, but to get her down for her pedestal, in
order to be able to approach her ...and seduce her.

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DeepBlue:
> Optimus:
> Virtually guaranteed ways to get laid:
>
> 1.  Be famous
> 2.  Make lots of money.
>
> What is it specifically about these two things that
> are so attractive and
> desirable to women?

[portions cut for brevity]

Optimus continues...
> How can we, effectively steal everything that a very
> famous, very wealthy
> man could give to a woman, and link it to ourselves,
> so that there is
> essentially ZERO difference between us and a
> famous/wealthy person in her
> mind?  Other than putting her into somnambulism and
> telling her that we are
> wealthy and famous person?  I'm sure people out
> there have already thought
> about this, and have developed some cool techniques
> to do it.  If anybody
> has any ideas or methods for this, please share.
> I'd also like to know if
> people think this is irrelevant, and not worth
> investigating.

[more portions cut for brevity]
>Clifford says:
> I think you have hit an important nail on the head
> and I would like to hear from everyone with ideas
> about this.

Okay, you wanted to hear from everyone so let me suggest an "alternate"
point of view for Optimus to consider:
Have you ever found yourself in a new and special place and you suddenly saw
things differently so that all sorts of things you thought were SO important
suddenly seem laughably unimportant?
Can you imagine a rich and famous man at home in his beautiful mansion...yet
feeling so unhappy and depressed, despite all his fame and riches, that he
blows his brains out?
Now can you also imagine some dirt poor guy wiping the sweat from his
forehead after a long day of work outdoors and he has a big happy smile on
his face for no particular reason other than his love of life?

If you find this special place inside yourself and you experience it deeply
then it will practically radiate from you. Your deeper vision of life will
touch the
women you talk to and, without being able to explain it, they will see life
differently in your presence.

The fame and wealth these women are programmed to run towards like little
windup dolls will suddenly appear to them as a pile of worthless glitter
that
perpetually promises happiness but can never actually deliver. Suddenly they
will not want to waste another moment of their short precious lives on such
things.

Incidentally, this deeper truth is hinted at in stories like the movie
Titanic, and that is why women respond to that movie as powerfully as they
do.

Oh, and regarding "AssMan"...
> Girl 2 was a Chinese chick outside the university
> library.  After I grabbed her ass, she whipped
> around ,faced me, and  said something
> unintelligible, I commanded her to RELEASE  YOUR
> INNER GODDESS, follow my voice and surrender to the
> ultimate sensation that you feel penetrating you
> NOW.  I paused, she said "ok"

Fucking-A!  :-)

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Bucky:
I just had my first ever club-sarging experience. I went by myself and it
was not too positive. I felt exactly like I did when I first started sarging
in public. It's weird because I don't have problems making approaches at my
normal hunting grounds (usually coffee shops, bookstores,and malls), but
clubs are a completely different environment. I only made two approaches and
they were quite short lived. It seems like SS languaging would be difficult
because of the noise, so I imagine your game must be conveyed mostly in your
attitude. I have a couple questions: first, since so many girls get real
"dressed up" when they go to clubs, is there any way to tell the difference
between the ones that want to fuck and the ones that want to fuck w/ guys?
Also, could some of you experts offer some general suggestions for someone
who is just starting out doing club sarging? I'm guessing that clubs offer
the biggest challenge for the PUA/SS'er.
Also, if there are any pros in the Southern California area that are willing
to help me in regard to clubs (or whatever) please contact me at
buc***[email protected]***.com[ ? ]. thanks.

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Assman
Did anyone see Ross Jeffries on TLC, The Learning Channel  The Science of
Seduction on Feb. 14?  Very good bit, although alot must have been edited, I
would have liked to see the whole seduction.  He used
pure hypnosis, got the girl to focus on an object, a flower, got her to
visualize it and close her eyes.   The girl was definitely in a trance, and
seemed to
enjoy the experience, at the end Ross asked her for her phone #, "not just
because the cameras are here" she readily agreed and seemed  to have genuine
interest in Ross.

Ross was very good, a real master at delivering a hypnotic pattern.  From
all my past experience, I know that inducing a lowered state of
consciousness is the most effective way to acquire a women.  Forget about
approaches, gimmicks, and what you smell like, learn those patterns,
memorize them, and improve your delivery of them; it's what matters most.

The hypno pattern in Ross's book about 'his friend Mike' is a good one.
Would like to see some postings of more hypno inductions/patterns.

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cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.

NON SEDUCTION-RELATED:

RECOMMENDED:

One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from alt.seduction.fast, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.

NOT REVIEWED YET:

Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):

 

[all words] [any words]

INFORMATION ABOUT THIS NEWSLETTER ARCHIVE:
This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
cli***[email protected]***.com[ ? ] and it will be done.  If you would like to be added to the free joke list, just ask.  For those of you unfamiliar with the references to Speed Seduction»Â®, Clifford highly recommends your visiting http://www.seduction.com/.  For those interested in seeing the previous e-mails that were sent out ("the archives"), they are available on request to Clifford or, preferably, can be browsed and searched at the archive at http://www.fastseduction.com/cliff/.

By your accessing this archive, you understand that the information contained in within is an expression of opinions, and they should be used for personal entertainment purposes only.  You are responsible for your own behavior, and none of anything you read herein is to be considered legal or personal advice.  You also understand and agree that any products you may order as a result of your reading about them in this archive are produced and sold independently from us and that any complaints, disputes or other issues which you may have with the sponsors of these products are to be dealt with directly with said sponsors and we are not responsible in any way whatsoever for any issues which you may have with them.   If you are not in agreement with any of this, please leave his site now.

DISCLAIMERS:
This newsletter and the newsletter archive in general is reproduced here with Clifford’s permission.  Visual enhancements and search features have been added by the fastseduction.com webmaster to facilitate the reading and researching of the content.  The raw text as it appears here is exactly as it appeared in the original e-mail newsletter.  Products, services, or external web sites mentioned or linked to in this archive does not denote endorsement of those items.  The contents reprinted here are the opinion of the original writer(s) and are not necessarily the opinion of, nor endorsed by, the owner(s) or operator(s) of fastseduction.com.  The archive enhancements are generated automatically and there may be occasions where the visual cues don’t correlate exactly with the textual context; most of the time, though, the enhancements are pretty accurate.  The archive is updated as regularly as possible, whenever new newsletters are sent out.

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