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"The Silent Pause"

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The Silent Pause
6/8/01 4:27:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time


The following is a repost of something that I have noticed is a very
powerful tactic that Mark Bednarski. had written up for the weekly Don Juan
email tip.  With permission from Mark and Allen Thompson, here it is with my
comments at the end.

The Silent Pause by Mark Bednarski

I learned this technique in sales and I have been applying it with women
with great levels of success. I call it "the silent pause" and it involves
staying silent as a woman speaks, after you speak, and until you get a
desired response. It is the silence between what we say that gives it
meaning. Use this tool as a powerful force to get what you want.

Do this on the following occasions.

 When approaching a woman for the first time, comment on her beauty.
 When asking her for her number, ask her for it and then stay silent.
 When asking her for a date, ask her then stay silent.
 When asking her to come over to your place, ask her then stay silent.

Say nothing after your initial statement and wait for her to respond.
Staying silent after you speak motions to her that you expect her to speak
and establish a level of communication with her. Never interrupt her and
continue to motion her to continue when she stops. You will know that she
finished her thought when she asks you a question.

By staying silent you also put the ball in her court and place the onus on
her to respond. If she agrees then you get what you want. If she objects,
say nothing but continue looking at her.

If she says no, for example, to you going out in the next two weeks because
her dog died, say nothing but continue looking at her. By responding to her
objection you confirm in her mind that you agree with it and take the
pressure off her. By saying nothing you show her that you do not accept what
she says and expect a different response. In most cases she will come up
with a different response from her original one.

To give you an example I was at a nightclub once and I got a number from one
girl that I chatted with for a few minutes. When I called her the number was
a wrong number. I bumped into her a few months later at the same club and
said, "You gave me the wrong number," and paused saying nothing while
looking at her. She ended up giving me the right one and we ended up going
out for the next two years and three months.

The power of the silent pause is that powerful. As the level of discomfort
builds to such an extreme point when nothing is said, then she has to
respond differently to take the pressure off the situation.

The other option is for her to walk away. However that option is far worse
than giving a different response because by walking away she indicates

Another reason that this works is that when you stay silent you hear people
out. Women especially need to feel understood and are more likely to go with
your suggestion when they feel that they are being heard. Staying quiet and
not interrupting gives them a sense of assurance that you are listening and
care about their views.

Another reason this works is that you come off as mysterious and intriguing
by limiting what you say. She will try to figure you out and this will keep
her interest levels high.

By listening and staying silent and not countering what they say, I have
been able to score more numbers and dates - by staying mysterious,
intriguing, and a good listener.

** More Silent Pause **

I wanted to expand on the topic and offer further insight and
suggestions to ensure that the technique is used properly.

To recap, the objective is to say what you need to say and stay
silent, and allow protracted pauses to occur in between what you say
and what the woman says.  Keep what you say short and to the point and
place the onus on her to talk.  Ask her questions to keep her talking
and say little about yourself.

One of the keys to making this effective, I noticed, is that you need
to keep facing the woman and make eye contact with a smile when you
remain silent.  Otherwise she is likely to think that you are not
interested in her and may walk away.  Exceptions occur in obvious
situations where she cannot walk off, such as in a car, or when you
are sitting down at a meal.  I found that when you do allow protracted
pauses to occur make sure that you are looking at her in the eyes
directly and smiling.  This coupled with the silence seems to elicit
intense feelings of passion and desire in a woman.

While in a conversation and employing this technique, I've had women
come up to me and kiss me without me initiating anything, by simply
looking at them and smiling.

Think of when you kiss a woman.  There is usually a longer period of
silence that occurs before it happens.  By being quiet and smiling you
are in effect creating an atmosphere subconsciously comparable to when
you begin to make love or kiss passionately.  If you can do this as
soon as possible with a woman when you meet her, you will elicit the
same intense feelings of desire and passion in her.  She will feel
them and, in a sense, see you in a more attractive light.

No one ever kissed anyone by talking.  Remember stay silent, look at
her and smile.  Force yourself if you have to.  I read that the famed
Russian Rasputin used the same approach to score with 1000's of women.

By using this technique I've had women offer me their numbers,
unsolicited, and some have even brought up the topic of sex first when
meeting them for the first time.

For example, I've had a woman recently, within the first 20 minutes of
meeting her, offer me her number.  And after I suggested that I needed
to go home and shower, she alluded to wanting to take a hot shower
with me.  Another one just blurted out that if her and I had sex we
would go for hours because she felt a great amount of sexual energy
between us.  Another one said she had not had sex for 18 months and
wanted some relief of her sexual tension.  Another one said she loves
to have sex on ecstasy and gave me her number without me asking, so
that we could go out clubbing to a rave bar where they take the drug.
All this within 20 minutes of meeting them and using this approach.

You may ask yourself, "How do I do this?  I cannot allow silence to
occur like this.  It seems very uncomfortable and they may walk away."

You can use the rule of 5 - 10.  When she finishes count to anywhere
between 5 and 10 in your head before you say anything.  The more you
do it the better you get at it.  She will not walk away.  Trust the
process and you will see.  The first time this works for you, you will
see the power of the technique.

You may also ask yourself, "How do I maintain a conversation by being

Ask her lots of questions and follow-up questions.  Example: she says
she just came back from a trip.  Ask her, "How was your trip?  What
did you do?  What were the highlights?  How were the clubs?  Etc."
Remember to look at her and smile when she answers and allow between 5
and 10 seconds of silence before the next question, and never ever
interrupt no matter how important what you want to say may be.

When she asks you a question, example "How is work?"  You say "It's
fine.  Just rolling along."  Follow with a question.  "How is your
work going for you?"  She will go on forever.  Remember also to tell
them you think they are beautiful/attractive, etc.

Also remember to resist the temptation to talk about yourself... no
matter how interested or demanding she may seem about getting info out
of you.  Many women will seek to find out about who you are and what
you are all about.  If you reveal little about yourself, you will keep
their interest levels extremely high and in pursuit of you.

Women also have a habit of wanting to know about your interests in
other women.  These questions I would simply just ignore and not even
acknowledge.  Staying silent about yourself also prevents her using
things that you say against you.  I found this to be the biggest
romance killer of all time, for me at least.

Remember comment on her beauty, ask her questions, keep quiet, smile
and look at her in the eyes.  Happy hunting.

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My Comment:  In my life I have had a few of these "non-verbal" experiences
and I think putting this all together would be extremely powerful.  With
regard to the above silent pause, this happened to me a few times.  One time
in particular I was out with a couple of guys, one of whom had met these two
women and the five of us were having a drink at a bar downtown.  I didn't
say much (since it really was my friend's sarge) but was smiling and looking
at them and these women kept coming back to me from their conversations with
the other two guys, making a lot of surprisingly interested comments about
me including a comment that "I was the kind of guy that women are looking
for."  And I barely said anything.  I think that what happens here is that
if you use silence in an intelligent way, women fill in the blanks and do
this in your favour.  Others who have had this experience are encouraged to
add their thoughts (and there's one of you out there who's been telling me
he's going to be sending me a post about the non-verbal part of seduction
now for months -- now we're all waiting for you!).


Recently I have seen a lot of talk on the list about "being the alpha male»"
and g/f stealing. I figured I would add some powerful insight to the recent
topic of the list.

About 2 months ago a buddy of mine and I were arguing the concepts of g/f
stealing and what needs to be done to maintain alpha male» status in today's
society.. Here is some of what we shared..
> Say you are dating a wonderful woman whom you seduced
> using NLP.  Say a few months down the road
> you and her get into an argument which gets rather
> heated and she leaves to cool off.  Say she goes to a
> bar you both frequent and gets a drink at the bar.
> She is distraught over your recent fight and is
> questioning your future together.

Cut to relevant convo:
Third, NLP is not something that you use to build a relationship, it is made
useful in maintaining a healthy one, as well as using better language to be
understood in earlier parts of a relationship. I have told you that without
rapport you cannot run a single pattern. NLP is not used to manipulate
people it is used to help people understand each other better.

Anyone say "re-frame"?? : )

Fifth, I will not allow a single woman to be on a pedestal at any point in
my life, they are all equal. None of them are better than another. So, why
should I tell a woman that she is greater than the rest, by committing to a
monogamous relationship with her if she hasn't proven to me that I am going
to spend the rest of my life with her. The idea of monogamy is another
concept we have to thank Oprah Winfrey and AIDS for. I practice safe sex and
have been tested negative for AIDS, so I have the right to go out and get as
much pussy as I can within reason, and juggle as many women as I want
because they have to prove to me that I should settle down with one. I am
not telling you that I won't get into long term relationships, that would be
ignorant. I am telling you that I will not go into it with the idea that the
woman cannot be replaced with a better one if she fucks up.
> She is very
> vulnerable and open to suggestion at this time.  A few
> drinks later a very charming man sits next to her and
> engages in "nice" conversation with her.  After he
> incorporates some NLP on her, they leave the bar and
> go back to his place where upon he has his way with
> her.....your girlfriend.

C-Ya later HO!

Flings are another thing, but there is nothing that says a fling cannot
extend into a long term relationship. Sex on the first date is something
that society has been shitting on for years and years. How the hell are we
going to enjoy any part of the rest of our relationship if the sex isn't
good? Life
is short, let's cut the bullshit and get down in the sack and find out how
each other fucks, and get into the rest of it later. How many relationships
die from lack of sex? I believe that the number would be staggering if I
wasted my time to look it up. Besides TRUE emotions are not elicited on a
first date, so lets just have fun and get in the sack.

I think you are missing the true concept of seduction. It is life, it isn't
women, it is the grand scope of things. It is improving your possibilities
of success in life and it is also making sure that you continue your
on this earth through your children and have a good time doing that with the
proper mate. If the internet is showing you how to do it more effectively
than your past experiences with women and life, then I say go balls out and
visit as many URL's as you can, buy some books at the bookstore, do as much
as possible to learn and change, because a past of failure is a lot
easier to look at than a future of failure. Do I get your attention now?
> Do you believe that people should be courteous to each
> other unless shown a reason to do otherwise?

No, they need to show me first why I should be courteous. Even if
I read the Bible, it reads "do unto others as you would have them do unto
you"; as a mature alpha male» I EXPECT men to try and fuck my girlfriends,
and you know what if the whore cheats on me then she isn't what I really

How the heck can one person really make that much of
a difference in one person's life. A woman is just a woman, nothing more,
is not a goddess. Men that put too much stock into their opinions of women,
and only one right one, is setting limits with themselves and for women.
Essentially: "That woman is like no other." I bet you say that to your
girlfriend (about your ex) and she'll get pretty pissed off. So, do I have
your attention yet??
> How can you justify approaching a woman who is taken,
> for nothing more than a sexual motive?

If she is taken she will let me know if she has any self-respect. If not,
she is a fuck buddy and I laugh in her boyfriend's face for being such a

You aren't gonna fall in love with every woman you meet, and you surely
don't want to, especially with some of them. The objective is screening them
find out which ones are worthy.
> I admit that my resentment over this comes from
> personal experience.  But even before this I
> vehemently opposed cheating!  It is destructive,
> hurtful, rude, disrespectful, hateful, nasty, BAD!

You are admitting you are wrong, you are allowing past experiences to effect
the way you view the rest of your life. I agree there are some learning
experiences that we have that we stick with, but they are not ones that
limit the future and the way we think. Stop limiting your views, be the
Alpha Male».

I am just as opposed to cheating as you are, if I was ever cheated on, the
bitch would be gone, I would be throwing her ass to the curb for the rest of
the world to chew up and spit out. You see, men have been taught to love
women the wrong way with this societal bullshit programming. If you are
subjecting yourself to being hurt by a woman then you are the gamma male,
because if you are hurt because of another male, you are the beta male, but
you can't be the beta male, because you are also being hurt by the beta
chick and that makes you a gamma male! In fair relationships it is: alpha
beta female. Females are the power in life that keeps this planet so
beautiful but they aren't the only thing on this earth either!

I am not challenging cheating. I am giving reasons that there is no such
thing when it comes to unsatisfied relationships. Before marriage where
there is no level of commitment that people have with each other that should
keep putting each other on pedestals. After marriage is a different thing,
properly formed marriages are priceless and are not to be reckoned with.


Well, in whole you are stating your argument about something that has
happened to you and now you are letting it continue to effect your life and
your decisions and to limit the possibilities that you have in life. This
can reach into very broad sectors of your life that will cause you to put
self limiting views upon things that are possible, but you fear to push the
envelope for fear of "what could happen".

I would be more than comfortable bringing my women around other men cause I
know that most men are betas and I KNOW I am an alpha. NOT ONLY THAT, if the
chick sleeps with my buddy then I kick her to the curb. Remember! She is not
the only woman out there!

Seduction is more than just an internet site and a style of picking up
women, it is life without the surrounded bullshit that culture has forced
upon us.

What is really wrong? The morally wrong and TRULY UNETHICAL things are
wrong. Remember back in a time of the 1800's when we weren't experiencing
this bullshit like Oprah Winfrey and Kathie Lee Gifford! Then use THOSE
ethics and morals because they are the ones that really were true for human
life. Society as a whole has grown, some ways not for the better, sort it
out, live with what you have, and diversify yourself!


Not sure if I mentioned before, but I knew a master PUA, Danny, when I was a
kid (17-19) and was too clueless then to learn much from observing him.  I'd
been considering trying to locate Danny since 3 months ago but never got
around to it, totally lost touch with him.  Then, after meeting Cliff &
David in Montreal, I decided "it's time" and my initial search was
Then, out of the blue, I had to get some print quotes yesterday and the
company I ended up calling (the office manager gave me a sample packet from
them) was coincidentally the second place I worked with Danny at (just
briefly at the end of college for about 5-6 months).  It was too
coincidental so when the sales manager came down today to show some print
samples, I asked if Danny still worked there and he said "yeah".

I calculated the odds for this event.  The odds that this info would plop in
my lap around the time I decided to actively look for him is roughly
365x7:1.  The odds that the first print place in the greater Boston area
that I would
call to get quotes from would be the place he worked is about 150:1.  And
the odds that I would end up at a new job in the area where this place had a
secondary office is about 20:1.  That's 7,665,000:1.  I would have better
odds trying to win the state lottery.

"When the student is ready, the master will appear."

In case I never described Danny previously: when I knew him, he was
just a bit taller than me (still a short guy), barely ever shaved, always
t-shirts with occasional burn holes (the kind you get when smoking a joint),
sweatpants, hand deformity, loud presence, not very fit (my kind of build),
never graduated high school, drove around in an old ratty van.  At one point
he lived out of that van for 2 months and STILL got laid 3 times.  And he
would tell me things like "I never try to meet chicks in bars or clubs, only
on the street or regular places because [insert obvious reasons here]."  I
never saw him get one-itis and I always saw him working on any doable chick
in the vicinity.  I only saw him get nervous ONCE and that was only when he
went out of his way to try to "show me the ropes" - performance anxiety I
guess :-)  When we walked buy some WARPIG one day, he blurted out "Hi!" and
she shrugged him off and he turned to me and said "Women like that should be
friendly to ANY guy that says hi to her."  I replied with "That's obvious
but why did YOU say hi to her?".  He replied with a big smile: "Practice!"
would always say things like "Repetition builds speed and accuracy." and a
ton of other things that slip my mind right now.

As soon as I started talking to him on the phone I could tell it was the
same Danny I knew from before.  I will hook up with him next week and catch
and then start talking PU with him.  I knew him at the first place we worked
together and I think I was 19/20 when the place went belly-up.  He asked me
if I've gotten over my "perpetual virginity" since then... LOL.  The guy
just doesn't hold back.  Now that I think about it, I probably would have
much longer to get laid if I had never known him.

Not married, been through quite a few chicks.  Lived with a few.  I told him
the GF way of doing things is out for me for a while, especially avoiding
living with a chick.  I said "It's tough to fuck other chicks when you live
with one."  And he said "No it's not."  HAHA.  Then I mentioned I'll be
heading up to Montreal this weekend with a pal and he said "You didn't turn
fag, did you?"  Damn, this guy did not change.  Then, when I went to get his
number, he gave me his home # and said "But don't call me there... I'm never
home and there's no answering machine to get your message.  Call me on my
cell # instead."  Shit, that's exactly what I would have expected a PUA to
say.  And Danny has yet to ever get online - he's never been on the 'Net.
It's like this stuff is just PART of him, I still don't know where he
learned his attitudes from.  He's living in Woburn now (3 miles from where I
renting an apt. out of one of his brother's houses.  He's got a band with
his friend Victor and they do Pink Floyd covers.  He said they have a gig
20 and to make sure I have time on my schedule to see that.  He gets on the
phone and it's like energy energy energy.

He told me that he was actually trying to find me last month because he had
an old business card of mine (from college) that I printed using some crappy
inkjet (he was telling the truth because I remember which card he's talking
about).  He said his wallet got wet and the card turned into a soggy piece
of paper with a big blob of ink where the contact info used to be.  I don't
know what was stranger: the idea that just last month that business card of
he had got messed up or that he was carrying my card around at all after 7
years.  I get the sense that even if I didn't look for him, he would have
found me within the next month.

The student will soon be re-united with the master.  This time, the student


>Reasons why a girl with a boyfriend are easier to seduce? (These apply
>mainly to girls who are not SLUTS! This means a girl who is happy in their
>relationship, if a girl is a slut, dumb, drug addict, mentally ill or 'the
>one' then there's no real great effort needed to seduce them.)
>* - Many boyfriend/girlfriend relationships satisfy the stability factor
>included in a girl's MOTW (Model Of The World), but not the need to be
>uncontrollably sexy.

Spot on. This is the guy FILLING THE ROLE...of supporter, comforter,
messenger boy, etc. NOT the one fulfilling needs, fantasies, ETC.
>After all, a girl KNOWS (or at least assumes, until you make her question
>it) that someone they are in a relationship with loves them. But there is a
>constant need to re-assert the fact that they are sexy to the rest of the

And indeed, to explore sexually beyond where the Borefiend may be
taking her! SPOT ON!
>* - Girls in a relationship are not on the look out. Girls who are not in a
>relationship are on a constant look out for a guy that assumes the role of
>'perfect partner' or the nearest match. They will test and probe
>'potentials' to find out if they truly match her model of a perfect guy.
>When girls are in a relationship, they are much less likely to give you a
>probing (except after you've seduced them, hehe) and are therefore easier
>gain rapport with than you might think!

Again, keen insight. This guy rocks! Who are you? Are you an SS student?
>* - A GIR has an established pattern for her life and emotions. If you can
>find out her patterns you can wield them to your own evil ends. (This
>obviously applies also to SG (single girls), but a GIR often has strong
>patterns that include a significant other. If you satisfy that pattern,
>a good start.  If you satisfy it better than her original partner then you
>are already destroying her BF.)

DASTARDY! I say, I say D-A-S-T-A-R-D-L-Y even!
>1) Here is the way I have found some women get themselves into somewhat of
>a substantial loop.
>            *) Woman receives mental or physical stimuli
>            *) Woman converts stimuli to good feeling
>            *) good feeling conflicts with relationship criteria that
>that she does not feel good feelings from physical contact with other
>            *) Woman rejects feeling and tries to get rid of it.
>(We all know that when you consciously try to reject something you just end
>up rehearsing it and strengthening that feeling)
>            *) Woman rehearses and strengthens the feeling.
>            *) Woman believes that because the feeling has not gone away it
>must bear some validity, and therefore accepts that she CAN feel good with

Well, yes, but also remember that it becomes more real, because,

Remember, people are attracted to differences, but they ACT on
what is FAMILIAR 90% or more of the time.   You are on the edge of
some key power, young man!  PANKITY PANK ON THE FLANK FLANK FLANK as Tabby
would say!
>(This process works ONLY when the stimuli's intent is ambiguous. The art of
>working with GIR's is to make them believe that the feelings they are
>getting are because of their interpretation and not because of your
>intent. This way you are not a pig! And they are just as affected. This is
>important so that although you are hitting on them they do not reject you
>before you can gain good rapport with them in a context outside of their
>relationship. After all, they can easily reject you. But they CANNOT reject
>themselves! Ambiguous stimuli can be created in many ways, like hidden
>touch, incongruence, etc. (more on this later?))
>2) to 'break the rules' is an excellent reason to sleep with someone. Isn't
>3) If you use the substantial loop effectively you can overload her
>system so she just has to stop and question 'If I feel this good around
>I must not love my BF?'. (boyfriend destruction!! hoorah!) either that or
>she'll sleep with you and think about it afterwards...

Or connect feeling that way with you to entering a state where the
rules and roles and other chains, tying her down, just don't apply.

If you are THAT far from what she is used to and you stand SO far
outside the normal places in her mind, then she isn't cheating on a

If you are a vegetarian, who is used to eating broccoli, and
suddenly you switch to carrots, in a sense you are now "cheating" on
broccoli. But, if suddenly, you start craving and savoring juicy red
steaks, you aren't cheating on the are having an
experience totally outside the range of what you are used to.
>My Comment:  David has a unique time strategy.  He will set up a date and
>continually call a woman telling her what he's up to ("I'm just in the
>shower, I should be done in 15 minutes," etc.) and while he does this he is
>continually putting her off to keep waiting.  But she knows what is
>happening, he's in touch. But she's being kept waiting for him!  This sets
>up a great anticipation on her part.  David once told me that your most
>powerful weapon is curiousity.

He's right on the money; plus she has to imagine him naked in the
shower!   Not a bad thing!
>Being the Alpha male» doesn't necessary require brawn or brains in the short
>term.  It's just being the guy people see as in control of the situation.

Ok. I got that; this is a good definition and I can work with that.
>Over any extended period of time, it's going to require lots of thought and
>appropriate aggression.  Aggression is a normal and natural human trait.
>being able to channel that aggression appropriately may land you in jail,

Yes; aggression has to take into account your outcome and the
consequences and context.
>The main
>key was that I wasn't paying much attention to them (just listening to the
>situation) and when I did speak, I did so with authority and challenges.

Good move, and especially viewed against the back round of the AFC's
who were doing the opposite of that!
>Eventually I had to talk the girls into staying because the guys were so
>lame at it ("Please come to the hot tub, please!!!").  When that happened
>it was over, because I had asserted my dominance just by taking the girls
>aside and talking to them.

A simple thing like changing the physical location works very well. I
>I think for most people who are looking into SS on the net, the brains
>department is probably overdeveloped.

But not on the subject of women; they are flailing around with
NOTHING to aim at. Being more aggressive won't help them if they
don't know how to intelligently direct it. They may be whizzes at
physics but don't know boo about PUA.  Capeesh?
>  > The emphasis on dominance is a dangerous one when discussed amongst
>  > those who are simmering with years of frustration about the
>  > perception or reality that women have dominated THEM.
>Is that what you were thinking when you put that info about controlling a
>girlfriend with the door on your seminar???  That is way across the line
>than any of the aggression I use.

Let me correct you: that was Alex, a student who was subsequently
banned for continuing to promote that mind-fuck. We re-did the course
in 1998 and ELIMINATED that pattern completely. As far as I know, it
is not and will not ever be included in ANY current material.
>  > My attitude is that
>she will fuck me eventually, whether she's attracted to me right off the
>or not, because she is living in a wasteland of Neanderthals and I have a
>talent for opening up her imagination like no one has ever done before. If
>I tested them to see if they were going to fuck me before I even cast my
>spell, then why should she fuck me? Because she fucks random guys all the
>time or because I'm a Greek God? I feel much more comfortable being
>intimate with a chick when I can understand why she would go home with me
so >soon - i.e.  I seduced her powerfully and subtly and therefore she had
no choice.

I agree with how you put that, but I don't think David is talking
about this either. But I agree, attitude alone will only get you
laid if she already likes your looks or if she fucks random guys
anyway.  Too narrow a field for me; I want to use my ability to move
her emotions and imagination with my language, energy, voice, and


"I recently went to Ibiza and was considering dumping my medical career when
I saw how much ass the travel representatives get (now these are guys with
room temperature IQ's, average looks - most of them have flabby stomachs,
and basically nothing going for them) and they bang at least 50 chicks a
(April-October) for the two reasons I give above"

I went thru this "bartender discovery" a while ago and at first didn't
believe it.  I remember talking to some guy  who worked at a resort
somewhere in the upper Midwest (not exactly as glamorous as Ibiza) who told
me he worked during the summer for college break.  He said that he would
usually have sex with 20 women every season and that other guides would as
well.  I didn't believe the guy, he was a salesman now and was kind of
pudgy.  However, I  have heard of the same stories from other resort workers
as well.  And many bartenders told me the same story, having sex with many
women (many more than even your top SS'ers and other associated PUA's).
Basically it's a free introduction.  I couldn't do it, dealing with drunks
all day and being in a position of subservience would get to me, and a
resort would require relocating.

It's a shame, you can work at PUA/SS which requires intelligence and
effort, or you can be some oaf at a bar/resort and get laid like a goat...


(Commenting on Thomas: "(..)I finally got a hot babe (20 year old virgin)
into bed, but had to stop just after pushing my cock in for an inch or
so coz she was yelling in pain. (I gave her plenty of foreplay
and she was wet like a sponge)  What am I missing? Any advice on how to make
love with a virgin (especially over coming the pain of the first time -
should I put my cock in slow or what?? Or would hypnosis help?)"):

Take your time, respect her time,  embrace her emotionally (and
physically), be gentle, touch her whole body, each of her cells,
take your time, feel her, it does not have to be your way, there
are thousands of ways of doing it... Make a ceremony out of it.
Go back to your poetry books... Make it poetical, make it sacred.

And make it different. Be creative,  focus your performance on
your incredible chance (it may not happen again in your lifetime
and she is offering you a jewel) and not on your performance...
But, first of all, take your time, respect her time...Feel for her.
It is a great responsibility: this moment will impact her
whole life as a woman, her whole womanhood and somehow, women do

feel it, perceive it, intuit it. It is not just some socio-anthropological
ritual (now happening on the backseat of a car in some countries)... You are
in charge of opening new doors, new worlds, of creating good, ecstatic cells
of memories  in herself... Good Luck !

My Comment:  Spoken just like a woman!


Dr. Sulo,
I noticed someone on your list brought up Custom Criteria
Installation (TM). If you'd like, you can offer your readers to HEAR the
whole newsletter on REAL AUDIO at the following location (I did this
at 4 am so my voice is not at it's peak but the content is there).
It's about 18 minutes and IT'S FREE.
Because of bandwidth restrictions only about 100 people will be able to
listen to it before I take it offline.

REMEMBER: REAL PLAYER needs to be installed which can be picked up for
free at

Once Real Player is installed you can just click on the link below and
it should begin playing within seconds:
if your readers want the written version, have them send a
blank email to cus***a@co***.com[ ? ]


> >My idea of the Natural Leader is someone who inspires. This person has a
> >good sense of his own personal power.
>Good; that makes sense. What has that to do with the
>socio-biological stuff you were spouting earlier about women
>responding to the most powerful guy? Inspiring has to do with using
>a lot more complex structures and processes than the socio-biologists
>draw upon, like language, symbology, etc.

The way I see it, Bill has morphed Major Mark's idea of Being That Man into
something called a Natural Leader. My guess is that it's a useful construct
that works for HIM. Correct me if I'm wrong here, Bill, but I imagine that
when you think of Being That Man, you see yourself as the Natural Leader of

Since Bill made up the idea, it can be anything he wants, that's why he
keeps changing his definition.


Magic Juan:
>Any good alternatives to: 1. I don't go to bars & clubs. The chicks are
>too young & dumb there. 2. I'm into outdoor activities as I live in
>Northern California, the San Francisco area.

Was out there last month. A good alternative to bars and clubs is an
open mike night at a coffee shop (for poetry, music).

Another place I did well is on a tour of Alcatraz/Angel Island. On this
I am not suggesting "Hey, go to Alcatraz" as much as what I noticed: being
mutual tourists gives you something to talk about and with a chick who
clearly is interested in doing something besides hitting a bar. This was
especially true because although I was out on vacation and was particularly
geared toward entertaining myself, she lived there and could have chosen to
do anything else that day.

So, given you live in such a cool area, would it be helpful to you to view
it through the eyes of a tourist? What if you regularly pretended you are
on vacation and you want to do something fun in this area before it's over?
How many options would open up for you? And since you know there will be
chicks to meet, what frames can you come up with ahead of time?

You are certainly in the greatest place for the outdoors. You might have
to get creative to be in the outdoors and also be where chicks congregate.
This might mean you have to stick to tourist attractions. Do you like to
take pictures? This would allow you to bring your love of the outdoors to
other places for discussion. Maybe not as helpful in meeting chicks as
in amplifying things once you're already met.


Hypno Bill:
My reply to Ross:
Years ago I learned that in a debate both sides were closer then they
thought. I had initially had focused on the differences before I had learned
any better. In such cases things seemed to get out of hand. What I would
call an intractable position. Traits and beliefs would be ascribed to the me
by the other side that were not real by any measure. Thus the divide would
widen like a great chasm. I could expose the truth but only to find deaf
ears. Even with some more wisdom I had thought I'd just clear up the
differences so that there would be understanding. Still no good. So I
learned to embrace the sameness realizing that most debates were only shades
of gray. By understanding where the other party was and letting them know
that I could understand their world much progress was made. Especially when
I focused on the similarities then the shades of gray really didn't seem to
matter anymore.

In this instance we agree on some rather good points.

Jerk behavior is not supported by either one of us.

We agree once again that humans are complex in their make up and actions.

We agree in showing someone an understanding of their world.

We agree that it is important to touch a person at the deeper levels
bypassing surface resistance. Or what could also be called automatic

So what has the shade of gray been here? Well, I believe that humans still
have instinctive drives. The continuum could be described as on One Extreme
No Instinctive Drives at all to the other extreme that all actions are
controlled by instincts.

My position is that clearly we have vast choice and latitude beyond
operating out of instincts as the only source. So I would be somewhere on
the continuum located on the side of no instincts.

Ross, even if you could truly say that in your opinion humans operate with
instincts at all, there still really isn't that much difference between our

cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.



One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.


Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):


[all words] [any words]

This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
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This newsletter and the newsletter archive in general is reproduced here with Clifford’s permission.  Visual enhancements and search features have been added by the webmaster to facilitate the reading and researching of the content.  The raw text as it appears here is exactly as it appeared in the original e-mail newsletter.  Products, services, or external web sites mentioned or linked to in this archive does not denote endorsement of those items.  The contents reprinted here are the opinion of the original writer(s) and are not necessarily the opinion of, nor endorsed by, the owner(s) or operator(s) of  The archive enhancements are generated automatically and there may be occasions where the visual cues don’t correlate exactly with the textual context; most of the time, though, the enhancements are pretty accurate.  The archive is updated as regularly as possible, whenever new newsletters are sent out.

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