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I could take a man home just by looking at him
8/18/01 12:58:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time


Claude update:
Those who have been reading these emails from the beginning (or who have
read the archives) may remember one of my first posts which was about
Claude.  I recently ran into someone who was in touch with Claude recently
and an update follows the original post which I have included below:

Probably the first "natural" seducer I met was "Claude." Claude lived
(probably still lives) a life out of a porno movie. While my experience
with him ultimately turned bad, I think more good for me came out of it
overall than anything else. I credit Claude with waking me up, making me
lose my naivete at a crucial time in my life. I met him at a hamburger
joint where cars park all around the big circular structure and either go
and stand in line waiting to be served or waitresses on roller blades (this
is way before in-line skating) would come to your car and serve you. Claude
was dynamic, original, funny, etc. Being with him and just watching
television was like being at a party. He was always joking around, prodding
you to do things and coming up with stuff to do. But he is a psychopath. He
is one of the only two people I have met in my life who literally live from
minute to minute. Both of these people don't keep food in their fridges;
Claude would go to a supermarket pretty much for every meal (or a
restaurant or whatever; but there was no long term planning in his life).
He lived off what he could make scamming or off women (he had at least one
woman I knew of -- the separated wife of a guy he knew socially -- who he
would go over to her house -- actually the guy's house that he would lose
in the divorce -- and do the wife; while there wasn't a direct charge for
his services, she would ask him if he needed money and he would always get
$60, $100, etc. from her -- actually the guy's money too. This was a lot of
money 20 years ago). One of the things that (I felt) appealed to women was
that when he approached them he was more interested in what he could get
out of them materially rather than sexually, and I was sure that they
picked up on this fact and that made him different from other guys. Not
that they picked up on his wanting to get something from them, but that he
was not primarily motivated by sex. He was a sexual maniac; once he picked
up this super hot babe, took her to his place, and in the space of two
hours came 12 times with her. He says he was starting number 13 when I rang
the doorbell.  While I found this hard to believe, I did become friendly
with his most serious girlfriend at the time and she told me he was
amazing, how he never got tired. Claude's sense of humour was one of his
biggest assets in getting women. He was totally confident of his abilities
also. I once asked him if he felt that he could always go home with someone
when he went to a bar and he told me that he just knew that he could. I
have seen him do and get away with things that I never would have believed
if someone would tell me. He got a big charge out of getting away with
things; he couldn't believe that people would let him do the things he
would do. And did he get women. They warmed up to him very quickly and he
took full advantage. I didn't know how he did some of the things he did
even though I was there when they happened. For example, we were driving
down the street and there's this very, very hot blond walking to her
apartment building holding two bags of groceries. I can still hear him
leaning out of the passenger side of my car, calling her "Miiiiiiiiiiiisss,
oh Miiiiiiiiisssss!!" and pretending to ask for directions. Within the
space of about 45 seconds she invited him to come up and visit her! I used
to think that he was probably so much better looking than I was but I now
think that it was his personality. He was a Jekyll and Hyde, though. He
could be absolutely ruthless. We met these two young ladies one day, picked
them up in my car. Claude, myself, the two women and another friend of
Claude's (male) (so we are three guys and two women) and we drove them out
to this disco about 45 minutes from where they lived. Well, Claude tried to
see if they wanted to have sex (they were interested in him but weren't
going to be that easy), if they wanted to go to get something to eat, if
they wanted to go get something to drink, etc. Essentially the answer to
everything was no. So Claude gets myself and the other guy to lose them in
the club and gets us out of the disco (and I am not proud of this to this
day) and we leave them there. He said to me, "Hey, they didn't want to have
sex, they didn't want to eat or drink, so they were completely useless" and
he couldn't care less. Another time we are walking downtown behind three
women. While they weren't really fat, they could have lost 15-20 pounds
each but they were attractive. So we are walking behind them and he starts
singing "Three Little Pigs"! What was absolutely amazing was they turned
around and started to try to tell him off, but it was clear that they were
so turned on that they could barely tell him anything! I used to watch
these episodes in amazement. Another time we went to a gym. He stands, arms
folded, legs crossed and leaning against the wall near the exit to the
ladies changing room. This really cute girl comes out and he stares right
at her crotch as she walks out. Instead of getting upset, she's beaming! We
went to California together. We hook up with Johnny, a really sleazy» friend
of his from Montreal who is living with this very good looking young lady
who apparently was supporting him. She in turn was being supported by three
"boyfriends", older guys who gave her cars, money, jewelry, etc. for her
attentions and affections. She lived in this gorgeous apartment in Redondo
Beach with a picture window overlooking the ocean. A few nights after we
arrived, we are out with Johnny and her and Johnny and her get into a
fight. Well, I still don't know why she said this, but she goes, "Well, I'm
leaving!", turns to Claude and says "what about you?" He turns to Johnny
and says, "Sorry, man, I'm going with her!" Here she hasn't talked to him
probably yet for ten minutes and she threw out the guy she was living with
for him. As I was staying in L.A. I stayed in the apartment with Claude and
her a couple of times, so this is a first hand account. He had a unique
style that just appealed to women's imagination. I remember he called up
this really gorgeous girl that we had met probably a year earlier. He
hadn't called her in all that time. He gets her on the phone and starts
telling her that he has this new car and wouldn't she like to be driving in
it with him, with everyone looking at them because they would both be so
good looking together. She eats it up and is ready and willing to see him.
He had interesting techniques in bars. He was always nonchalant in bars, as
if nothing was planned. I have seen him squeeze between a guy and a girl
who were talking at the bar in a crowded place apparently to order a drink
from the bartender. But then he would turn to face the girl, cutting off
the guy and start talking to her! He used to like doing magic tricks in
bars and met tons of women doing card tricks and small coin stunts. I have
seen him take home two women at once more than once, and he once told me
that he usually is able to hook up with two women once every month or two
(these being new recruits, not repeats). He could not hold a job for long,
although he did do stints in shoe stores, clothing stores, etc. When asked
what he did, one reply was that he had his own business. "What is that?"
he'd be asked. "None of yours!" was his answer. Or he would tell them that
he was retired. He would change his wardrobe each season; usually by going
into a clothing store, seducing the woman who worked there and she would
tell him when to come back when she was alone watching the store. She would
give him an empty bag, he would take what he liked into the changing room
and leave with a full bag. I used to hear or see some of this stuff (I made
it clear to him that I didn't like that, that he was smarter than that and
that I wanted nothing to do with this type of behaviour so usually he
didn't do this in front of me) and think he wouldn't do it to me. Famous
last words, as he ended up stealing from me and that's how we stopped being
friends. When he pulled that stunt on me, I pretty much fell into a
depression for about a year but came out of it stronger and much wiser for
the experience. I saw after that he had a pattern of latching onto guys who
were not as socially adept as he was who had things he wanted or could use
and he just kept doing what he was doing. Last I heard he was in Boca
Raton, married to some woman and desperately waiting for the two year
waiting period to be over so he could get his Green Card. I know that there
is a lot that I had seen and learned from him, and if I can remember more
that is worth mentioning I will write about.

Update:  Recently I ran into "DJ", a character unto himself who I met
through Claude probably 24 years ago.  DJ is a reasonably good looking guy
(although he now has gained about 40-50 lbs. since I knew him) who likes
(these are his words) "road kill, any kind of kill."  The women he goes
with are hard to look at, forget about sleeping with.  I will never forget
back those 23-24 years ago once going to pick DJ up at his house around
9:30 in the morning.  He was lounging around with a drop dead gorgeous,
incredibly sexy French Canadian woman who was clearly crazy about him.  He
could not wait to get rid of her.  He was talented at attracting women -- I
remember him being able to get women to give him their phone numbers very,
very quickly on the telephone voice personals systems (and the ones that I
personally heard sounded very attractive, but you never know until you meet
them.  Some are clearly not appealing but others...) And he picked up women
on the streets, on the mountain (Montreal is famous for the big mountain in
the middle of the city, Mont Royal, which if you say it fast enough brings
you to understand how Montreal got its name), on his bicycle, etc.  But
over the years he developed a comfort level with women that most of us
would find totally unacceptable (I am too polite to use words like "ugly,"
"dirtbags," "hags," "lard-buckets," and other similar but very accurate
descriptive terms).  In any event, Claude has stayed in touch with DJ and
DJ told me Claude is now living the good life in South Beach, doing all the
super models, flying a plane, investing in the stock market, thinking of
buying a castle in Italy, etc.  He recently made out with Carmen Electra
and is friends with Pamela Anderson, Martin Scorcese, and a few others
whose names escape me.  And while those of you reading this are probably
shaking your head and saying "Yeah, right, and monkeys are flying out of my
butt," I can assure you that I am sitting here thinking that, as outlandish
as it may all sound, I would sooner bet that it was all true than bet that
it wasn't.


Peta Heskell (Director of The Flirting Academy,
has sent me an extensive questionnaire which she is looking for people
(preferably women, from what I can tell) to fill out addressing the issue
of 'what do women want.'  If you would like to receive this questionnaire
and participate in the research, please write Peta at
inf***[email protected]***.com[ ? ].


Steve Boyley. CHt.  (NLP Master & Trainer The Performance Institute advises of a special presentation, Monday, August
20th by Kenrick Cleveland, Persuasion Master (see the site who will present live on the Internet at 7 PM
(California time):
For the chat times in your part of the world go to the NLP Mind Training
Club Links page.

In addition, There will also be an earlier meeting live on the internet at
11 AM (California time).
SLIGHT OF MOUTH PATTERNS  Voice, Video & Text Chat.
And now so very easy to find! Just go to this web site
Click 'Log in' or 'Join' to get full club access using your Yahoo ID, takes
a couple of seconds.

See the NLP Mind Training Club Calendar for future events. You can schedule
one yourself!


It has come to my attention that some of the readers of this List do not
yet fully realize the power of anchoring.

Anchoring is perhaps the simplest, yet, most powerful tool in a
seductionist's tool box. So it's about time, if you weren't using anchoring
yet, that you begin realize that you need to use anchoring. In fact, if you
aren't consciously using anchoring in your favour, I'm afraid that you are
most definitely creating anchors that you may not even be aware of!

So what is anchoring?

Anchoring is when you attach a touch, sound or other sensation (stimulus)
to a desired outcome, such as a state, an emotion, a physical reaction
(response). The way this is done is to apply the stimulus to a naturally
occurring response. For instance, every time your female friend laughs,
touch her arm (make sure you touch her in the same place otherwise you are
setting numerous anchors, all of which are not particularly strong). When
you have done this a couple of times, you will be able to bring the woman
immediately back into laughter, simply by touching her in the same place.

However, the point of this article was not simply to explain it. It was to
give a methodical approach to prove the mind blowing strength of anchors in
a non-seduction environment, purely and simply to spur some of the guys
with less confidence to use anchors more frequently.

So here we go. Here is an extremely powerful way to prove the power of
anchoring to you and your subject.

First of all tell your subject that you would like to teach them something
that you recently read. It appears fascinating, and if correct could really
prove to be a lot of fun and really quite beneficial. Once your subject is
willing you can just tell them to get into a position that they find
comfortable and you can begin to set an anchor in laboratory conditions.

Step 1.  Relax and aid the subject's visualization capacity.

In this methodical approach, just find a quiet area where you will not be
disturbed for a little while. Now begin by telling the subject what they
are actually feeling (stating observations of the subject's current state,
this makes transitions to different states easier).  For instance, lets
assume for a second that there is a faint humming in the room. Say
something like ‘As you hear that faint humming just beginning to relax your
entire body, just enabling you to become more aware of your breathing and
your ability to relax further’ (emphasize the words RELAX sounds cheesy.
Just try it).

Do whatever you want to enable your subject to relax further.  If you wish
to employ ambient ocean noises or whatever just do it.

To aid visualization, just tell them to imagine their mind is like a movie
screen, as they look on at their movie screen they may just be able to see
themselves sitting in this chair (bed, whatever) and as they look at
themselves they can see (describe their current situation, like the room
and intimate details about what they are wearing...) blah blah…

Bear in mind step 1 can be completely skipped over, however, you can get a
much stronger experience if you train the mind to reach deeper into the

Step 2.  Take them back to a past experience

Now you simply suggest this to your subject. ‘Now, just allow your
subconscious to reach deep down inside and retrieve a memory of a moment in
your life when you were with someone that made you feel purr-fect. (If you
haven't heard Ross do this sort of sarge then you probably haven't heard it
done well…) Can you remember the last time that you were with someone that
made you feel exquisite… When you were just holding someone and that simple
touch on your body lit that flame of passion so strong that you just felt
that HOT, throbbing passion ripping up inside of you and making you flood
with passion. Making you want and need to fulfill your carnal desire to
make love to that person.’ (Perform this sort of simple response conjuring
induction on whatever topic you wish to utilize, if you want to try it on a
male friend then you could make them feel that great feeling of security
they get when they're with their friends. Pretty much anything will do. (If
you can't be arsed to write any sort of script and you aren't good at
making this sort of thing up, don't worry. Stick to the basics and just get
them to ‘Remember a time when you felt good’.)

Do not perform step 3 till you have got positive feed back that they are
experiencing the memory (or indeed fantasy).

Step 3  The Dublin trick.

So we have our subject experiencing our state. Now what we do is we tell
our subject to notice what happens when they allow that picture in their
mind of that memory to get bigger as they put themselves inside their own
body as they visualize. As the image gets larger, as it becomes almost
panoramic. Isn't it interesting how you begin to feel those feelings more,
how you begin to     hear what you heard, and as the colours get brighter,
and it’s almost as if any blurring suddenly gains total clarity with a
‘CLICK’. And all the time you begin to feel those feelings more and more.

Now comes the Dublin technique...This is the most fool proof way I know of
strengthening any state. Obviously it often can't be used in a sarging
scenario, but here it is just the ticket.

I am now going to count to 5. With every number that I count you will feel
those sensations, those extreme feelings and emotions inside of you, just
waiting to get out...double. (You really need to emphasize the word double.)

‘Now you can feel those feelings DOUBLE as we go to 1.’ (You need to deepen
your voice on every number that you say and very much emphasize the words
double and especially the numbers.)

‘And we'll DOUBLE it again as we go to 2’

‘And those extreme feelings burning inside of you are growing stronger now,
like ten thousand bolts of electricity just tearing out of you DOUBLING to 3’

‘And you can hardly contain those feelings as they DOUBLE to 4’

‘And now as we go for the extreme peak of experience let it DOUBLE to 5’

Step 4  Anchor

As soon as your subject hits five, just touch them on their designated
anchoring position. I recommend the middle arm. Just the soft part that you
can easily reach that touches both the bicep and the forearm. Just gently
but firmly give it a squeeze and say ‘Purr-fect’ (as Ross uses) (However,
my accent lends itself much more to a strong GOOOOD…. So be your own master.)
then retrieve your hand, make them break state, by just asking to open
their eyes and questioning them how good it felt…and repeat the second part
of step 3 and step 4 again twice. By saying ‘Okay, so now you know what to
do, just let yourself go for the big one this time...I can see you can
experience even more….and that’s a great feeling isn't it..’

Step 5  Fire the anchor.

Okay. So now you have set the anchor 3 times in an extremely powerful way
(on the last setting I like to tell the subject I will go to 5 and then go
all the way to goes beyond what they perceive is their limit,
therefore totally blowing them away...). Now you can either use the anchor
straight away or wait a little while to fire the anchor. Just say the words
Gooooood and touch the anchor at the same time and apply the same pressure.
You will see the unbelievable results this has straight away. (Especially
if you have just set a sexual anchor and you set it off, lets say, on a
public bus... The girl seriously had to change her pants when we got home .
I kid you not!). It’s even more fun to set the anchor off in the middle of
a conversation. Like, you know I was wondering if you could lend me some
money... It’s just that I count you as a goooooood (anchor) friend.. (you
may not get any money. But it’s a funny little trick..).

Well, this is pretty much a fool proof way to set your first anchor if you
haven't already. Once you understand what needs and doesn't NEED to be
included you can adapt and change this pattern to your own ends. This
information is purely and simply to allow people who haven't already, or
would like to experience an extreeemely powerful anchor, experience it in
an easy to follow procedure.


Ross:  (Commenting on "Mark     Sure. All my sympathy - but do not be too
hard on yourself. I've been there. When I was a teenager I had horrible
acne that lasted until I was 21. No pussy for me from the age of 16 until
21. Once it cleared I started getting
laid regularly."):

Let's reverse brag; in high school and college I was 6 feet tall and
weighed 125 lbs.  I looked like a skeleton. Some people were so
cruel...were it not for NLP the words would still sting; now I can look and
laugh. But people would say, "You look like you've been in a concentration
camp" Or "don't you eat? Why don't you eat some more potatoes?"

I was so skinny, my veins showed and on the occasions I went to the Doctor
he would actually give the staff an anatomy lesson.

I hated my looks so much, I removed all the mirrors from my bedroom so I
would not look at myself.

I also had thick, cokebottle glasses in high-school; this was before
plastic lenses. Also braces and my hair was a HUGE "afro". (Some chicks
actually like the big hair, but what did I know?)

Dude, I not only had the corner on ugly, I OWNED THE ENTIRE BLOCK!

Ross Commenting on: "(She found me very intriguing and interesting for a
number of reasons - BUT what she said more than anything else was 'You
know, it is really strange that you talk to people you don't know. I
wouldn't normally talk to someone out of the blue.' Now after internalizing
this, I started to think  It must be really important either to
a) pace her reality or
b) give a statement of intent (SOI)
Without either of those, her mind started to wander about why I was talking
to her? Did I do this all the time? etc."):

I would have said (and have!)'s an extraordinary thing for me
to find someone WORTH talking to like this. But then again, who only wants
to experience what they are used to? The routine? There isn't any fun in that!

Ross Commenting on: "(But then I started thinking about being vague and
mysterious.  Was it more compelling because I was a stranger?
I started to think about common pick up line that I have heard RJ use.
'I know this is a strange way to meet people, but I saw you there and had
to come over and introduce myself.'  To me this accomplishes alot - it
paces what she is thinking and also calms her because she can frame what
you are doing based on a experience she
probably has already had - I suppose the auto-pilot that RJ was talking

Yes. She's just comparing you to what is familiar. When you don't get what
is familiar, guess what? THAT IS CALLED A SURPRISE!

Ross Commenting on: "(In her world - A stranger approaches her, introduces
himself - she realizes that he must either be 'really friendly' or trying
'to pick her up'.  Either one of these she is familiar enough with that she
will not be spooked."):

Maybe he just spotted someone he hoped was worth talking to. Isn't it nice
for both of you when he finds out he is RIGHT?

Ross Commenting on: "(So what does the group think?  Is the Intrigue of a
Stranger more important - the shock value so-to-speak. Or Pacing her
Reality and SOI so she call on her own experiences and feel more at ease.
But I can just smell the desperation, and she's only 21, and here's the
main thing that's turning me off her pussy stinks.  Alot of young girls
just aren't aware of the need to always take a bath before sex, and it's
disgusting!  I tell them to shave, but telling them to clean is just
outside of what I want to have to do!  One girl, a very classy, young,
feminine, rich sweetheart once bent over for me and had a dirty bum.  I
almost puked as the smell of (bleep) assaulted my nostrils."):

Tell them. Stop being afraid and TELL them.

Tell them, Look...I need to talk to you about something. It may hurt OR you
may enjoy it, I really do not know. I say it only because I want to be with
you in a way that lets me be fully turned on, and right now, I can't do
that.   Your personal odor is a little too strong...I don't know if it is
normal for you or if you have a health problem, but you might want to have
yourself checked. I'm not trying to be hurtful or meaning, just being
honest with you.

Ross Commenting on: "(Now, I know that if I told her to clean it, although
she would be extremely embarrassed, she would do it.  But I'm tired of
these little girls that need you to teach them EVERYTHING.  And the better
they look, the more they need to learn how to fuck, act, talk, and be.  So
instead of playing doctor therapist savior, I just want to "next her".  I
used to spend so much time fixing and molding these girls, but now I want
to find one that's already educated, and capable.  Enough."):

It really doesn't take much to tell her.  Or, next time you bang her, reach
your hand down, get a good sample, and put your hand under her nose. She'll
get the idea...

Ross Commenting on: "(Yes, but that's still doing something to cajole them.
I know some guys who attract women via "Hard to Get" games. But they still
have to close at some point. I mean the woman doesn't exactly rape them
when they get laid (usually)."):


Ross Commenting on: "(My basic point is that just because a woman is
attracted to you doesn't mean you can fuck her."):'s a start but not enough.

Ross Commenting on: "(In my AFC days I even got girls who wanted to fuck me
back to my apartment, or have had them ask me to spend the night at their
place "because it was too late to drive me home."  I can remember that all
I would have had to do was grab them and kiss them and I prolly would have
had sex with some really awesome women. Instead I talked about stupid shit
all night until they figured I was either not a man or not attracted to
them. The next morning I would be forever exiled to the friend category.
If a girl is attracted to you, it doesn't mean that she wants to fuck you
every minute of every day. So it's useful to be able to calibrate her
attraction and put her in the mood to fuck."):


Ross Commenting on: "(What if you were a male super model but were really
shy and the only time you got with a girl was when a really aggressive one
jumped you, and then when that happened, you were too nervous from the
unexpectedness of it to get it up? You would be attracting aggressive
women, but then you still couldn't fuck them."):


Ross Commenting on: "(I believe we are talking about the same type women.
The type that Sys and Mystery get - young, beautiful, conceited but with
low self esteem, shallow, and usually with closed minds and 0 taste in
music. Club girls, in short."):

That's what I kinda think in some respects. I think virtually ALL women
enjoy a funny, cocky guy. It's the "never give her a straight answer" type
evasion that is going to turn off a more mature woman with some
self-esteem. She'll LOVE the cocky, LOVE the funny, LOVE the refusal to
ass-kiss, but CONSTANT withholding of straight answers is going to piss off
a woman with self-esteem and brains, and eventually bore her as well.

Subtract out the CONSTANT withholding and CONSTANT controlling and I think
the more healthy types would go for it.

Ross Commenting on: "(I really can't get into it if I think the girl's
convo is boring and materialistic."):

Spot on; I won't cater to these types at all. Or types with just pure bad
attitude who need to pick a fight every ten minutes just to reassure
themselves they are still alive and breathing. Who needs it?

Sure, you could train to handle could train to handle pit-vipers
too. Personally, I got better challenges to face.

Ross Commenting on: "(Yes, there are woman who would look at you with a
"Gag me with a spoon" attitude if you came up to them and complimented them
on their energy or told them you wanted to analyze their handwriting. I
generally believe these women to be closed-minded. Women with the attitude
that you're a nerd if you think deeply. These girls aren't what I'm after."):

Amen. AMEN. I couldn't have said it better. That is EXACTLY what the pure
Sis/Mystery approach is going to get you.

Personally, I find intelligence sexy in women and I would hope they find MY
intellect sexy as well, especially as I apply it through SS. If they
don't...if they are more focused on what kind of slacks I wear and what my
loafers look like...if I am hip enough for their girlfriends to like..they
can eat my anus til their tongues are brown.

Ross Commenting on: "(Perhaps this AM would be good for other types of
women who also would not respond to SS, and I do read Sysonpyh's newsletter
and posts. In fact, sometimes I act like the bad-boy to get initial
attraction before the seduction begins. I'm not against the methods, I just
took offense to Sys's putting down SS just because it doesn't work for him.
SS is not the only method I use. But alot of what Sys seems to condone is
simply "being a jerk" which does attract women, just the wrong kind for me."):

I think being cocky and funny works well with MOST women; it is the
withholding info and other headgames that are going to fuck you up.

If you withhold info, you also will withhold communicating what you really
want from the other person...and that has to be incorporated in, sooner or
later, if you want more than fucking.  SS allows for this.

Ross Commenting on: "(I don't remember reading any romance novels where the
hero "gave the chick a chance to suck his cock," or thought of sharing
emotions and giving women profound emotional experiences as "faggot shit.""):

Also, look at what labelling it "faggot shit" says about the labeller; that
for them, profound emotion is NOT part of sex. Just squirting your dingus
in, and the excitement and power of devouring a tasty object.  Sure, that
is a-ok and PART of it, but it is also missing the other aspects of what
great sex can be.  Isn't it?

Ross Commenting on NightLight9: ("We talked for while about fluff and I
elicited values.  She was there with 4 other girls and they were all coming
in and out of our conversation.  I was
aloof and funny, but no patterning, just displaying personality, building
rapport and mirroring, etc."):


Ross Commenting on NightLight9: ("She said she didn't date anyone and that
she just wasn't into it.  I said "Doesn't that bother you?  Not being able
to give all that you have to

Good. Your response was powerful because

1. It was unexpected
2. It pointing out how she might be losing.


(Commenting on "Joseph said:
Well I'm not Mystery, and I don't like those kind of women. So if I  were
good at his method and was banging a bunch of young materialists I would
prolly have to learn some other technique in order to get the girls I

Josh replies:  Huh?  "Young materialists"?  If you have actually
READ Mystery's archives you would
know that Mystery has had teachers, TV producers,
women in their 30's, etc.  In other words INTELLIGENT,
MATURE women.

(Commenting on "Joseph said:
I just took offense to Sys's putting down SS just because it doesn't work
for him."):

Josh replies: I never saw him put it down... he quoted a friend of his as
saying it was "faggot shit" but I don't recall reading that he said that
himself.  He did say that there are better seduction methods than using
NLP.  He said flat out that when he used SS it
-sometimes- got great results but his current tactics work better for him.

It's getting quite boring to read all these arguments.  A person like Ross
or Mystery or Sis comes along and gives us FREE KNOWLEDGE, with an option
in some cases to purchase more.  How you apply it is YOUR business.  I want
to nail strippers and models so I use Mystery Method» (FMAC) as an
UMBRELLA.  I'm not there yet but I'm working on it.  What Sis and Ross
teach FITS IN to the Attract phase.

Since I am not too bad looking I have just been smiling, joking, and using
games like the 4 Magic
Questions, and a little bit of patterning to close. I'm not working on 9's
or 10's yet so this may change. You have to do what works for YOU.


In response to RJ's question about what games I play, I once did an extensive
post to your list about games, and just using game language,i.e. "Simon Says",
"Mother May I", etc.  I like physical games, i.e. grab your nose with your
and finger of your left hand.  Now, try to put your right arm - elbow first -
through the triangle space you've created, catching stacked coins off your
elbow or fist, etc.   One of my favorite games is to draw one side of a
person/stick figure then fold the paper down the center so that they can't
see what you drew.  Then, the other person draws the other side.  The idea is
to create funny looking people because the sides never match.
Another great game can be played with cheap jellybeans or M & M's.  Have them
close there eyes and guess what color you are putting in their mouth.
Another game is to softly trace along their forearm and let them guess how
close to their elbow you stopped.  Eventually, you can have fun doing this
along the inside of their thigh.
I once went to a NLP'er party at a Grinder practitioner training.  They had a
great calibration drill.  Person "A" would close his/her eyes.  Then someone
would lick their ear/neck.  Then, the person has to guess who did the licking.
Anything can be made a game.  For example, I have quizzed women on restaurant
menus ala Jeopardy while at the restaurant, or once when I introduced a new
girlfriend of mine to a 3rd friend Paul I told her that I was up 3 Paul's to
zero.   Teenage games also work great, i.e. Truth or Dare, Spin the Bottle,
Strip Poker, etc.
Along the line of game playing, I find Toy Stores, and Arcades are great
places to take a woman.  Also, any activity that might have been popular as a
children's birthday party when they were growing up, i.e. miniature golf,
bowling, rollerskating etc.  Great question Ross!


My Comment: Ok, the following is totally off topic but was just too
fascinating for me not to mention.  I promise to be very discriminating
with regard to posting any replies to this, however.  I put this in here
because it is so interesting, but I don't want the comments to start going
in different directions.

I spent years on ritual magic, sex magick, Keys of Solomon,
Egyptian Mystery Schools and such. The current passion is pre-history. I
think it's hilarious that scientists and scholars are sticking to a 6000 year
timeline for the Book of Genesis when archeologists have disproved
this over and over again. We have human skeletons that date back
2.6 million and 5.8 million years so what is this 6000 year
bullshit? So called scholars point to dinosaurs as the basis for
the timeline but they've been gone for 60 Million years so they weren't
around to gobble up cavemen in the last few millenniums.
All the records are in a chamber under the Sphinx but the Egyptian gubment
has absolute security on the thing. Might as well try to rob Fort Knox. The
Sphinx itself is a million years old,
so who built the fucking thing? And did you know we don't have the
technology TODAY to build those fucking pyramids? We couldn't replicate
the damn things if the survival of the world depended on it! Fascinating
stuff though.


Jaime: I would like some tips on how to drive him crazy and ways to wrap
him around my finger.

My Comment:  Ok, ladies and gents, comments and ideas for women are hereby
requested.  And something original please, not just "get on the stairmaster."


Ahhhhhhhhh. The smells of love. As a kid in growing up in Poland I remember
my grandfather telling me a story about a beautiful woman he once met in his
younger days at a dance and succeeded in bringing home. While at his place,
he took his hand and reached into her panties from behind her. He suddenly
felt what seemed to him to be brittle little pebbles. Out of curiosity and
instinct he crushed them and then brushed his hand across his nose only to
reveal that the little brittle pebbles were indeed dried shit stuck to her
hairy bush. Needless to say what was the end of the evening.

In my previous post, I described story about a woman who accused me of taking
sexual advantage of her while she was supposedly sleeping, when her
extremely strong vaginal odor became fully apparent to both of us while in
the middle of a make out session on her couch. I guess that she tried to
divert her embarrassment away from the situation and cause me to feel guilt
for supposedly taking advantage of her rather than focus on her smelly
vagina. We were laying in the couch making out but she was nowhere near
sleep for the three hours that we were there while the movie Titanic played
in the background. I guess sinking of the ship at the end of the movie
foreshadowed the end of that evening. When I pulled my fingers from inside
her to taste her juice we both could smell her strong odor as her nose and
mouth were next to mine. She became so shocked and embarrassed at the fact
that she had that level of odor and that I could smell it at that time that
she accused me of taking advantage of her while she was sleeping and threw
me out of her apartment never to allow me to reach in the sweet spot again.
funny that she claimed she and her ex-husband (short 10 month marriage)
never consummated the marriage and he refused to sleep with her for a long
time prior to them getting married. I wonder why and why she married a man
like that? I guess what I smelled that night was nowhere near the full
potential of that beast. This was one of the scariest moments of my life for
I thought for sure she would press charges for some sort of sexual assault
and I would have been finished. She did not.

On another topic
One thing I noticed recently is that when I do not respond to a woman's
nonsense they invariably end up coming back nicer and more demure and
apologetic than before. Recently, I've had women slam the phone on me, curse
me and yell and tell me they did not want to speak to me again. I left them
alone and did not pursue them and within a few days they ended up calling as
if nothing happened and offered to take me out to lunch or dinner or to cook
something for me. Amazing, I think. It seems as if walking away from
volatility and not acknowledging it shows a woman that you will not tolerate
her nonsense and be a real man.

I know this one HB fitness competitor that I want to score but she has a BF
that seems to stand in the way. She told me that she went to a street
festival this weekend and stuffed herself with food. I responded by saying
that she must not care anymore about her condition. She blasted me with
accusations of me being malicious toward her. I did not respond. Next day
she sent me an e-mail saying that she brought for me some home made lasagna
and wanted to see me. This I have been doing over and over again to women
recently at the slightest hint of bullshit from them and when I do not
respond to it they come like back demure and obedient ready to please
puppies. Funny, eh? (as we Canadians like to say.)


Eric H.:
> Scott D
> Here's another psychology/personality game that was taught in psychology at
> uni (I told by uni friends). This one makes the chicks cry and

You forgot one thing...the cave..."on the path you find a cave, what do
you do?" (I think it's right after the water.)  The cave represents the
unconscious mind. Some people explore it while others just go on without
a second thought because of fear of the dark, etc... Something else to
add to your test...


Dj eclypz:
I just had to forward this to you. I have been emailing an older woman for
some time now, and I guess she decided to do a background check and came up
with some interesting stuff. I'm actually quite flattered that she went
through the trouble to look up so much:

Well, it was a great ride while it lasted.  I've read some of your posts
here and I'm wondering if you haven't perhaps tired of the game - if so
better for you.  I'm going to share something with you that probably 2
people in the world know since it's not really part of who I am any more.

I used to be a master (or perhaps mistress would be better) of seduction.
I stopped counting my lovers when I reached triple digits and I wasn't sure
I had counted them all.  I was probably about your age - maybe a bit older,
and of course, this was the carefree 70's - free love and all that, women's
lib and the fact that women were finally realizing they had a sex drive as
powerful and sometimes more powerful than a man.  I could take a man home
just by looking at him.

That, of course, stopped when I got married at 30 - even though my marriage
sucked and was a mistake from the beginning.  When I got separated and
divorced, inadvertently, I found myself up to my old games.  Which was
okay, because I needed to sense myself as a woman again, needed to reattach
myself to my sexual power since I'd buried it in a really awful, painful,
abusive marriage.

Then I discovered something even more powerful.  That sex with the same
person who you have a strong attachment to in and out of bed can blow you
away in ways that you never thought possible.  And that the fascination and
attraction of the hunt and capture pale beside someone who learns your
rhythms and your secret places, who opens up your vulnerability and shares
theirs, who integrates love making into the fabric of your lives together.

There is a connection you can find that is beyond the best that the purely
physical can offer.  But it takes time, and the focus that one single lover
can give.  If you're being satisfied whenever it strikes you, you forget to
long for them, anticipate them, hunger for them.  And you miss that
lightning strike when you finally connect after absence and all the ways
that you can connect when you're apart.

There is so much more that you will miss.


PS - did you forget or did I forget to tell you that one of the things that
I do in my strategic consulting is research via the internet?  Of course I
checked you out when I realized I knew little about you.  Here's just a
little of what I found.

My Comment:  What she found were Dj eclypz's posts to these
emails!!  (Deleted to avoid repetition.)  I guess we are getting around!

cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.



One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.


Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):


[all words] [any words]

This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
cli***[email protected]***.com[ ? ] and it will be done.  If you would like to be added to the free joke list, just ask.  For those of you unfamiliar with the references to Speed Seduction»Â®, Clifford highly recommends your visiting  For those interested in seeing the previous e-mails that were sent out ("the archives"), they are available on request to Clifford or, preferably, can be browsed and searched at the archive at

By your accessing this archive, you understand that the information contained in within is an expression of opinions, and they should be used for personal entertainment purposes only.  You are responsible for your own behavior, and none of anything you read herein is to be considered legal or personal advice.  You also understand and agree that any products you may order as a result of your reading about them in this archive are produced and sold independently from us and that any complaints, disputes or other issues which you may have with the sponsors of these products are to be dealt with directly with said sponsors and we are not responsible in any way whatsoever for any issues which you may have with them.   If you are not in agreement with any of this, please leave his site now.

This newsletter and the newsletter archive in general is reproduced here with Clifford’s permission.  Visual enhancements and search features have been added by the webmaster to facilitate the reading and researching of the content.  The raw text as it appears here is exactly as it appeared in the original e-mail newsletter.  Products, services, or external web sites mentioned or linked to in this archive does not denote endorsement of those items.  The contents reprinted here are the opinion of the original writer(s) and are not necessarily the opinion of, nor endorsed by, the owner(s) or operator(s) of  The archive enhancements are generated automatically and there may be occasions where the visual cues don’t correlate exactly with the textual context; most of the time, though, the enhancements are pretty accurate.  The archive is updated as regularly as possible, whenever new newsletters are sent out.

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