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He can talk about everything even without knowing anything
2/10/02 12:31:29 PM Eastern Standard Time

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Kk hh:
I've seen a recommended site on the list called "Mind Control Manual", and
it's not NLP at all. Can anyone tell me how this weird site made its way to
the list and did any of you guys
really have success with it?

Clifford: There's been a lot of discussion in the past about "psychic
seduction" and "Mind Control" and some guys have had interesting successes
with it.

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GameMaster:
You have a new subscriber named Mike K. Mike was a bartender at the Men's
Club during SpaceLord's reign of terror. He moved to San Fran over a year
ago but we still keep in touch. I asked him to put together some thoughts
on how best to approach strippers and this is what he advises.....
"My best advice comes straight from the WHOPPER computer "Joshua" in the
movie War Games with Matt Broderick. The only way to win is not to play the
game!"
BTW, we were laughing our asses off and comparing notes a few weeks back
and discovered we had both nailed 6 (minimum) of the same chicks. Most we
don't even remember the names of but the guy was a quiet monster. Oh yeah,
and here's the best part.....he was tricking out the girls from the club
for $500-1000 a pop, including....... yeah, my GF! But I still love the
guy! : )

Clifford: The advice on strippers is too thin. I'd love to get a more
detailed action plan if he has the time.

GameMaster: He's murder with the gals but he's done with strippers. Mike's
the only guy I'm still in contact with from the Men's Club days. I tried to
get him to work up a post but I have to agree with him...just stay away
from them.

Clifford: That's probably the best advice of all. Problem is most guys just
can't resist the hot looking ones, no matter how bad they are for them.

GameMaster: I know, they make for great visuals. Too bad they're so lousy
in the sack. Can't remember any exceptions to that rule.

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Mark B.:
> Mystery: Consider the GROUP THEORY thing, bro. It's worth the effort to
work the friends first because the cool thing is, when you are speaking to
them and actively ignoring the target, she STILL gets to hear everything
you are saying. Your personality still goes into her head. : )

MB: This I see how it can be true. But there comes a time when you have to
go after your target and then what do you do? Here in essence you are
trying to get her attention inadvertently first and then pouncing on her,
right?
> Mystery: I KNOW this is limiting the opportunities. You are waiting for
the situation to be ... RIGHT ... rather than looking for the RIGHT WOMAN
and meeting her through ... FRIENDS.

MB: The highest NHL scorers never chase the puck round like mad, they wait
for the right opportunity to come to them and then maximize their chances.
What you say, though, I agree with since it fits well with the setting that
you are in - tightly knit, engaged women in a bar setting. Still I cannot
overemphasize that if you approach her and she is interested in you she will
break away and give you room without worrying about working the group.
> Mystery: Hate it. Good that you are approaching, of course. It's just a
consideration to increase your opportunities. There are MANY great
situations you are not approaching because you are waiting for SPECIFIC
situations rather than going in right away ... you never know when a hottie
will no longer be approachable - time constraints impose themselves out of
nowhere sometimes.

MB: I disagree. I wait and wait but the wait is usually no longer than say
10-20 minutes at the most. And I can't get through I just take her
attention away from the group when there is a lull in the action. They do
not talk non stop all the time and after all they are at a bar to have fun
and possibly meet new people so if an opportunity comes along they'll
investigate.
> Mystery: "I like your friend. Are you ok with that?" This is GREAT! See,
you are removing FUTURE OBJECTIONS. : ) It's sweet man, trust me.

MB: I see this may give too much power to the guy. What if he says no? What
then? At least when you are hitting on her without his permission you are
conveying that it's your right to hit on her hence Alpha Male». Don't ask, take.
> Mystery: Aaaah, you shmuck!!!! (lovingly said, of course!) THAT was her
strategy! Dude, THAT is the girl I would have gotten! No joke.
She HAS to say what she said what with 20 guys hitting on her. And guess
what? Her little story not only worked to get rid of all those guys, but
YOU, TOO! A PUA! : ) Picking up a 10 is the exception to the rule, dude.
She didn't
have a boy toy. That's bullshit. She went home alone. You COULD have gotten
her ... NEG THEORY is DESIGNED for 10's! See the logical error? Because she
gave you her bitch shield, you fell for it and labelled her a MAN HATER.
She wasn't. She was just a LOSER-HATER. You have to be different so you
don't appear a LOSER. One GREAT way is to actively ignore her by being the
center of attention within her own peer group while you neg her and lower
her self esteem. I've been there, dude! This shit works. Anyone see my work
care to comment on my shit?

MB: Well, I would have loved to see you work her and get her. How would you
have handled this one with negs? I would like to see a detailed explanation
here. Also, what is your theoretical basis for disarming a bitch shield
through negs?
> Mystery: Yep. And so just by approaching directly, you get labelled
LOSER to her. She could have ANYONE. Anyone ... but YOU! That's when she
will chase you. Don't approach the target directly. Even more so, don't
approach her GROUP directly. Approach an adjacent group and MERGE one group
(preferably with women) with HER group. That way you were covered with
social proof before you entered. I do this ALL the time. It's STANDARD
GROUP THEORY, dude. : ) I love this shit! You lost the opportunity because
you didn't practice for those situations. The BEST girls are always
knocking guys down. ENJOY the challenge and use GROUP THEORY and NEG THEORY
to EXPLOIT her strategy. Heheehe.

MB: She was sitting on a stool with her fat friend not smiling and looking
out at the dance floor. Have me in terms of what? Get me how? Is this an
issue of control and domination of her over me - is this what you mean by
not having me?
> Mystery: Aaaah you see the failure? She has to choose to talk with you
based on your 5 second first impression. But if you approached the group,
you could make your first impression last 5 minutes long with great stories
and enthusiasm. She doesn't have to choose whether she should talk to you
or not right away. Let her choose that after she gets to see you talk for a
bit. To approach and say, "Hi, can I talk to you?" sucks. She will more
likely say no because it's her PATTERN to ASSUME you are just the next
loser in line. Dude, I've had GF's who were 10's. This is their PATTERN,
their PROGRAM. they are used to loser approaches. It's part of their
reality. BUT! They don't want to say yes to SOME GUY. They want to meet
their LOVED ONE "through friends." Have I convinced you? My workshop
TEACHES group theory in a BIG WAY. You can do approaches. Now let's get you
up to speed!

MB: First impressions count and for me the faster the better as I am in
control how she sees me right away. Loser approaches? I also have had my
share of HB10's, ones that get hit on several times per day. I asked them
why me and they say "well, because you were so direct and you did not
bullshit with what you wanted. You also did not let me squirm away and
challenged my behaviour, not like the other shmuks who kiss my ass and try
to be soft and tender." Give them the first thought of what you want and
are about before they begin to think anything other than what you want them
to think about you - this is the basis for my version of Speed Seduction».
> Mystery: And she'll only do that based on the view of you that she made
in too short of a time. If you are hot, ok, you have a chance, but wouldn't
it be nice to add in 5 to 10 minutes of talk before she needs to decide?
That's why a comedian who performs gets laid more than a comedian who
doesn't. Does that make sense?

MB: 5 - 10 minutes of talk. Sure after I come up to her and make a comment
on how great she looks in her dress - fluff talk about the bar then move in
for the kill but sometimes all we do is stand there and smile and they
(women) do all the work themselves.

Clifford: You are missing the point. In Mystery's strategy, she's watching
you from the sidelines
seeing you getting friendly with her friends and you are becoming someone
she can look at as not a total stranger, someone who she's heard say a few
intelligent things over a few minutes and is then able to form a positive
impression of. Then when you talk to her she's not looking at you as just
another guy coming on to her.
> Mystery: Was she a ten? I doubt it. Toronto? A girl you can approach
directly? No way. I'm talking about approaching TENS, dude. TENS! The once
a month OPPORTUNITY.

MB: Dude, she is beyond 10. She looks like a cross between Whitney Houston
and Angela Basset and fit like a tight drum. Yes Toronto and yes that
direct, Dude. It's important you expand your field of possibility. And yes
I met her cold in the lobby of The Royal Bank Plaza south tower in downtown
Toronto and she was married at the time (not any more and yes I did bone
her) and she still gave me her business number all within 2 minutes of
meeting her. So there - expand your field of possibility. Believe that
success can be had in any setting under any circumstances as long as you go
for what you want and not necessarily having all the right conditions in place.
> Mystery: How can she be into you if you didn't have time to convey your
personality, though? Convey within her group and then she will LOVE to talk
with you isolated. They are often honored to talk with me privately by the
time I get to her. (I'm not lying, ask any of my students).

MB: I do not feel that the condition to be successful requires you to be
able to fully convey your personality to her before you succeed or go for
the kill. When you act like you already have what it takes by not worrying
about conveying anything she implicitly assumes that you must already have
something about you of high value she may want. It's about confidence and
the image of "I got it but I do not need to show you because it's already
there."

Clifford: Mystery's methods are clearly 'another way.' Your way and his do
not have to be reconciled - there's more than one way to get a woman
interested. The ideal would be to develop the instinct to know which tactic
to use in which situation, because I am sure that no one (including you and
Mystery) is 100% successful using the same thing over and over on different
women. Different women will react different ways (sure, there will be a
number that will like your way, but there will also be ones that need a
different approach) - there's no point in looking at this as it's only my
way vs. your way.
> Mystery: Horrible. They must choose you based on 10 seconds. No social
proof, no alpha male» characteristics. No humour. No great envious persona.
She can decide based only on looks and lame compliment (ones she got a shit
load of times). Your successes have been aberrations.

MB: Before you mention statistical aberrations consider my sample size and
the success rate. About 15 strippers out of about maybe 40 I asked over 3
years and about a 37.5% close ratio out of ones I ask (for strippers this
is a good close ratio). No aberrations here. And yes it is that fast and
the basis of what I do is me, no other crap. Maybe success rate could have
been higher but remember that some are just not inclined to be picked up no
matter what you do. But the faster I work the better my success rate -
ambush and strike. Most if not all actual numbers and acceptance for
invites for me all happen within 3-5 minutes of first meeting.
> Mystery: That is a glorious waste of time. Watch me work a room, dude,
serious. I'll teach ya some great shit that will completely change your
game forever. No word of a lie. You are READY.

MB: What you do could enhance my approach. You could learn from me as well
and greatly enhance your field of possibility as well. I cannot emphasize
the fact that being in the right place at the right time is more important
to success than anything else. They must already have a need or if they do
not then it must be easily evoked. You can bend over backwards and forwards
but still get nowhere if she is not inclined that way. Try converting bin
Laden to becoming a Republican. Maybe it can be done but why waste the time
and effort? Better focus on other more worthy pursuits. I am much, much
better at recognizing those that are inclined to
me or to PUA in general and then doing what it takes to succeed more by not
fucking up more than anything. I feel that women want men who will give
them a feeling of congruity, logic and direction to her existence. Have you
ever met women who have been single for a long time - do they not seem all
over the place scatter brained? This is why negs probably work so well as
they challenge her bullshit behaviours and in turn endear her to you as the
guy that gives her congruence and clear direction that she so richly wants.
In fact, the best way to disarm neuroses and flake fucking is to challenge
it head on. Allowing it to remain only feeds it further. I feel that
evoking states, creating good feelings in her, befriending her friends,
being complimentary and open, being direct and all other tactics are great.
But it means very little if she does not feel the strength of your male
energy. We give her this by being in control of ourselves by acting
logically, congruently and in control. Women have a harder time acting this
way as their left and right brains are more richly connected than ours thus
facilitating a greater mix of emotion attached to thought. They have a
harder time detaching their thoughts from their emotions and look to us to
help them along with this process. A man that can do this for her is the one
that offers her the greatest fulfillment as a woman. I feel that women know
that their congruence and logic is not as strong as that of a man and when
a man gives this to her she feels fulfilled and safe with him. This allows
her to free herself to give herself to him with less worry that she'll be
disappointed, endangered, or hurt because he cannot stand up to the world
and do what it takes to survive in it. And this is probably the reason why
the less we cater to them the more they want us and the more we allow them
to control and direct us the less success we have.

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Gregory Rasputin:
> Daniel: Does anyone here deal with, or have ways to deal with sexual
inhibition and frigidity? I know many, many conservative girls, and before
you flood me with reasons why these girls aren't worth it, consider it as
another challenge and another weapon and skill in your arsenal....
Anyway, I know some sexual attraction patterns, etc. but what are the ways
by which to bring up specific fantasies (bear in mind that this cannot be
done overtly, as in a Grand Master PUA)without getting them embarrassed or
uncomfortable? The reason I ask is, a lot of women are mentally immature
and giggle at the sexual side of things, mainly because they attach so much
importance to it and it is such a deep part of them, that it often goes
unexplored.

Gregory Rasputin: Haha, here's one area I never have trouble with. Right
now, I'm dating a cop's daughter, and you can imagine how she was raised.
In the past, I'd take the most frigid girls, ones that haven't even gone
farther then kissing and just do what I wish. My always working, never
failing way of doing this is simply my attitude. All people who meet me are
a little shy around me at first because they've never met anyone this open.
I remember talking to some guy I met about his gf a while ago, and I asked
"so you fucked her yet?" in the kind of normal tone that this question
should be asked, and he just didn't get it...it's as if he's never heard
the word 'fuck' used in it's verb form. So, if you want girls to stop being
frigid, don't be frigid yourself! Her attitude reflects on you, and you
mirror that attitude, and get this self-propagating system set up where no
one gets any ass. You have to break out of this terrible pattern, and show
that you're a man, with certain desires, and you're VERY proud of those
desires, because they make up who you are, your personality, and you can't
possibly be any less then proud of your personality. So, just like Mark and
I always talk about, be open to her. Did she give you an erection? Tell
her, if she giggles look at her like a stupid little girl, and make her
feel stupid for giggling, ask "what...you've never heard of an erection in
your life...why is that funny to you?" If the skirt she's wearing makes you
wanna fuck her, tell her that. Don't be afraid that you'll sound like a
dog...it's who you are, talk to her about books, movies, but in the same
calm manner talk to her about sex. So many people need to learn that sex is
a normal part of life, and you're not a dirty swine if you like it, or talk
about it.
And to eclypz with a 'c': You're right man, treating this like a game is
bullshit. I used to do that, cuz I thought it was really fun, but damit, go
play something else. I treat girls like humans and not like "reproduce
unit, version HB9.3". Many students here get the wrong idea, because they
want to be 'players'. That takes no effort, I could be that...I'd much
rather be the kind of guy who walks down the street and have the girls fall
for my charm, and talk in a way that makes girls tear up....not the guy who
can brag to his friends about this girl he boned at the club last night.

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HitmanPT:
>Clifford: the thing is that guys with big mouths attract women. Guys who
just
talk with the appearance that they know what they are talking about
(whether they do
or not is besides the point) exude a leadership quality that many women are
fascinated by.

HitmanPT: Cliff, I agree with your theory. And is easily proved: just look
at the politicians, these guys can convert anybody to their opinion. That's
what a good politician is all about, they "talk with the appearance that
they know what they are talking about". I can tell you an example that
happened in my country: there were two politicians that ran for Government,
let's just call them John and Peter. John is a truly honest guy, graduated
with a very high average, and is a very hardworking man. Peter is a
politician by nature, graduated with a medium average, he can talk about
everything even without knowing anything about the subject, he's not a hard
working man, had many women, has children all over the country (pays alot
of $$ for pensions to his ex wives). Well...who do you think won the
elections? Peter of course... What's this have to do with seduction? I say
a lot. When you demonstrate your "eloquence", your ability to speak well,
you're making a women admire you, like the politicians do, and as Maniac
and Mys pretty well cover, admiration is the key to success! Besides,
you're expressing your opinion on a subject, even if you don't know shit
about it! I believe this is an important requirement for being a PUA: you
must be able to speak well. Just look at Ross, by using only his ability to
speak he can fuck almost any woman he wants! I'm not saying this is the
only thing a PUA must know, every PUA has his own style, his technique.
Example: for Ross, it's very important to speak well, because, as far as I
know, his method is based on NLP, leading the girl to different states...
But for a guy who only PU's at clubs, it's not the most important tool, but
a useful one. For a guy that only PU's in Latino clubs the most important
tool is to know how to dance, and so on.
>Clifford: If she succeeds in changing you into a pussy whipped jellyfish
needing her approval, then you'll become something that she is not
attracted to.

HitmanPT: I've read a post (sorry, I don't remember where, I think it was
on ASF) from a guy, who successfully approached a girl and started seeing
her as a PUA. He was in control, he decided when they go and where they go.
As the days passed by, he began to fall in love. He started seeing her more
often and slowly giving her control (it started with small things). The
next thing he knows she's dumping him! Which is not a big surprise, he
became a total AFC, the girl was no longer attracted to him as she totally
controlled him, he's no longer a challenge but a guy who does her every
wish! Moral of the story: even if you want to keep seeing (= fucking) a
specific girl, don't ever lose the Alpha Male» status, don't give in
control! Always remember you are the man, you control the shots!
>Clifford: The only thing that occurs to me, though, is that there is an
element of deception involved because you approach the group with the
hidden goal of getting to the target - that's not exactly honest, is it?

HitmanPT: "All war is based on deception" - Sun Tzu, "The Art of War"
(great book btw)
IMO, when a PUA approaches a girl, it is never an honest action; what is
the goal when you do an approach? To fuck her of course! A PUA won't "date"
her, won't marry her, he just wants to fuck her and move on to the next
one, and that's not a very honest thing to do. I'm not saying that you
shouldn't do it (hell...I do it, too), or that you should be nice to the
women by doing
their every wish, I'm only saying that each tactic anybody presents here
regarding seduction can't be judged by being honest or dishonest because
all of them are not honest for the girl. When you fuck a girl and dump her,
she'll probably complain to an AFC friend she may have what a jerk you
were. (The AFC most likely would like to be the jerk that fucks her.) But
it depends on the girl, maybe it's a girl who just wants to fuck with
somebody, no strings attached. Most of them enjoy sex more than we do : )
However, I will never approve (and I believe this is common sense) those
tactics that regard the use of drugs, drinks or anything that will make a
girl unconscious just to fuck her.

Clifford: Without going into a lot of detail, if your intention is to sleep
with her that night and you tell her that, how is that not honest? No one
says you have to marry a girl just because you approach her - that would
totally scare most of them away anyway. Fucking and dumping is an immature
model of picking up women - more intelligent is to make a friend out of her
(whether you see her again or not,
she shouldn't leave you thinking you are a jerk) who will greet you with a
smile when she sees you out the next time.
>Eclypz with a "c": So, anyway, this game you speak of, when is it over,
and how do you know
you have won? Seriously, is this more like the perpetual tic-tac-toe thing
from "WarGames", where it's an infinite loop of moves and blocks that lead
to more moves and blocks, or is there an end in itself somewhere?

HitmanPT: Everybody has different goals at different times of their lives.
For example: in weightlifting, I want to achieve a target weight, in
university I want an higher average, and so on...as I achieve these goals,
new ones will emerge, usually more difficult to achieve. In seduction, it's
the same situation, I'm constantly trying to improve myself. It may start
with a simple goal like the Svengali challenge and constantly getting
harder and harder. My goal in this particular game (seduction) is when I'm
the PERFECT PUA who does not exist, like a saint who's searching for
spiritual perfection and knows he can't achieve it. So I must try to be the
best I can, trying to get closer to perfection. Of course, this is only my
goal; IMO each PUA has his own goal, it may be the search for a women he
can truly love, or get so good at this that they can go commercial and
start selling a product, etc... For me, it gives me satisfaction knowing
that I'm getting good at this. I like waking up in the morning and by my
side is a woman I just met last night. I like the expression on my friends'
faces when I arrive at parties with different hot girls each time. Hey...I
know this is not "politically correct", like Cliff says, but it's my life.

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Craig:
> Joseph: All this group theory stuff is really arbitrary. In clubs or
bars, you can approach the target and do handwriting analysis. Her
girlfriends will beg you to do their's as well. Do her friends and you are
fractionating as well as inspiring competition. Also, some non-verbal
rapport from Essential Skills (www.essential-skills.com) will help out with
groups. I think all this "performance" that Mystery uses for groups is
totally unnecessary. Just get a $15 Grapho Deck from www.myhandwriting.com
and buy the $35 magical rapport CD from Essential Skills and you won't need
it at all. I don't.

Craig: I am curious to know what city you live in and the quality and age
of the women you are going for. I'm sure these techniques work well for
you, but I am also sure that you're not going to the kind of clubs or bars
that we have in major metropolitan areas like Hollywood or San Diego. I
have found that the best method for me when it comes to REALLY hot groups
of women is to approach the group as a whole with a question, joke or short
story. After I get them laughing and make a good impression I will bail out
and move on. The magic happens when I see them again, because now I can
approach the girl I want directly. I don't have to worry about her friends
getting in the way, because they already know who I am and they know that
I'm the MAN! Of course, they could meet some other people while I'm gone,
but I could do the same! I like the $15 grapho deck for when you have a
girl at your place, but I think the $35 could be better used as toilet
paper or to buy some D&G Pour Homme cologne (the best!). Rapport is over rated.

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DB:
> Clifford: The big mouth theory (I have wanted to etc.etc.etc.....

DB: Cliff my man, about all I can do is agree with you on this. All PUA's
that I know of are like this. These guys are like the Steve Martin
character "I am a wild and crazy guy" that was featured on early Saturday
Night Live episodes. Yes, women are drawn to them, without question. I
described a guy I knew who has success with women and that looked like Ms.
Hathaway from the Beverly Hillbillies and gave piggy back rides in bars. He
is also verbose. But these guys are playful, and that is always a turn on
to women. But I must say, though, that these guys are not the type of
people I would like to know as a friend. They tend to be insensitive,
manipulative, and self centered. If this is what I must become to get more
women, then let those guys have 'em. These types though are not usually the
most educated, you will not see them order an SS course or subscribe to
your newsletter. They also pay a price for their behaviour: one guy I know
has several drunk driving convictions, the other uses cocaine and another
had an ulcer from doing to many vodka shots. The key is to incorporate it
into your style, show them a little bad boy verbosity, if you will, so you
do not become labeled the suburban "Bob Zombie"! Looking back on it,
probably the most verbose guy of all time (or is it verboten?) was Adolph
Hitler. He had eight or nine girlfriends before he became ruler of Germany,
and his last before he met Eva Braun was half his age. Not bad for a guy
with half a sack and who enjoyed having women piss on his face. I wonder if
he used some sort of NLP to get women to do that.....

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CPowles:
> Clifford: The big mouth theory It has occurred to me recently that women
respond to big mouths. I've noticed guys like Alfie. He is loud and very
visible - he is always expressing his opinion and if he's in the room,
you'll know it. I have noticed a number of guys over the years who seemed
to have little more going for them than the fact that they were loud and
had motor mouths.

CPowles: I just wanted to comment that this is only ONE type of PUA. One of
the first and best PUAs I ever saw hardly ever talked. He was a natural who
could just make eye contact, take an HB into a dark corner or his car, go
at it, and then part without a word ever exchanged. When he did sarges

where he talked, he said very little. He just had a gentle, easy, yet
suggestive energy. My point is that it can be good NOT to talk or be a
loudmouth some times, because then women can project their fantasy on to
you. This was how he worked: he was quiet, mysterious, intelligent,
sexually intuitive -- a woman's adventure. This can also, as you say,
"bypass their expressed wholesome, relationship oriented, conscious behaviour."
> Clifford: Women all want the guy who's got all the women, the bad boy is
what turns them on.

CPowles: Yes, my new tactic, when I meet an HB I #closed is to call a
SECOND HB to meet us out, one who I don't desire as much. In addition to
the social proof and the "women want a man desired by other women"
elements, this is effective because the first HB has to work and compete
for me. Also, I can reward and punish the HB I want by choosing to pay
attention or not pay attention to the second HB. And when the second HB
finally leaves, the HB I want is elated to finally be alone with me. This
has worked really well lately.
P.S. I #closed a porn star today with a time constraint and a cube
take-away... : ) She's having problems with her borefriend. So sad...

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Christos:
While checking out some of the discount VCR stores in HK, I stumbled across
a ten HK dollar copy of the Tao of Steve. I remembered hearing some
positive comments on this list about this film and at that price (about a
buck U.S., I just had to see what it was all about. If you haven't seen it
then hunt it down as soon as possible. Not only is it very much on topic
for readers of this list, it is also quirky, funny and very watchable. The
main character, Dex comes out with some great philosophical one liners and
distills the whole pick up philosophy down into three essential steps.
1. Be desireless
2. Be excellent in her presence
3. Be Gone (do a take away)
True, the ending really is a bit soppy, I would like to find the book now
so that I can do a quick comparison. Also, I can't believe that he is
really that fat. Can anybody confirm that his huge gut is in fact foam
padding? In the meantime, everybody should really get their asses down to a
Blockbuster and check this out if you haven't done so already. If I can
find it here in China, then there really is no excuse for the rest of you
located in more civilized parts of the world.

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Insider:
I think the big mouth theory simply is more exemplary one way [ but not the
only way, thank God ] of demonstrating confidence. Cliff, as you know me
personally, I've been on a bit of a spiritual quest and part of what I've
been addressing is keeping my ego in check. I am searching for some kind of
medium between the over confident big mouth and the wise, strong silent
demeanor. In some cases as Mystery points out, the strong silent type is
not [ in the case of picking up strippers ] appropriate. Although I am not
the shy type, I do not feel comfortable with being an ass with flatulence
out the mouth in order to get hot looking pussy. This presents an
interesting dilemma because being a big mouth does show confidence up front
to people,
so one may be considered an ass, but an ass that gets laid.
Semi related to this is one observation I have made in the past two years.
This may be indicative of local attitudes where you are. If you live in an
uptight community, then those of you might have experienced this. In my
quest to fluff, and sarge, a female friend of mine once told me that she
was informed to stay away from me because I was "too friendly". I can't
really think what I did wrong, aside from simply being friendly. It may
have been the way I came across, but am not sure. I have since left this
particular area in the U.S. so it's not really an issue for me. However, In
some cases having a standoffish demeanor is better, even in certain parts
of Europe. What's odd about this is that it tends to contradict a lot of
the basics of seduction theory and practice all of us on this list come to
understand. I do need to point out that it comes down to being able to
calibrate the situation, though being able to determine if you're being too
friendly takes a little bit of time.

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cliff’s list advertisment section
Cliff’s Comment: For those of you who are just reading about this for the first time, I decided a couple of emails ago to add links to these emails.  The idea would be to get enough money in to hire someone to take over the administrative work (and also to buy things which would improve this list, such as proper mailing list software) for this list.  If you were going to buy the product anyway, just use the link that appears below and you are helping to keep this list going at no extra cost to anyone.

NON SEDUCTION-RELATED:

RECOMMENDED:

One of the best places for you to start your journey on becoming more successful with women would be to get David DeAngelo’s Double Your Dating» e-book.  David (who posts here under the name "Sisonpyh" — which is "hypnosis" spelled backwards) is a good friend that I have known for several years now that I originally met through one of Ross’ Speed Seduction» seminars.  His posts here have been among the most outstanding contributions I have had over the years and his book (and the free bonuses) is highly recommended.

Ron Louis and David Copeland have been reading these emails for awhile and recently sent me their Mastery Program Tape series which I have finished listening to. It has some very good stuff on it and that, in combination with other pieces that you can pick up here and from the other products mentioned can be a help. For those who are just starting out learning how to deal with women, this is an excellent basic daily course to take you through the process of dealing with women. For those who are more advanced, you should pick up a few good ideas from this set of tapes.

Comments on this product from Tony B.:
I thought I might drop you a quick line regarding some of the more popular sites that have been seen within this "seduction community". After seeing several terrible reviews and "flames" from alt.seduction.fast, I decided to make a decision for myself based upon my own ideas of what could be offered on the Seven Magic Words product and after several months of reading great novels about how to attract women and multiple posts about how women are most attracted to men, I STILL found the site to be beneficial. After joining the site, I was happy to learn all the new techniques that I have never seen on any list and that alone made it worth the money. I am not typically the type of person that spends money on a site especially a seduction site, I would rather pay for some audio or video, but the information that was offered was different and unequal to anything I have seen in the past.  At any rate, I know you wanted a review.. and I have actually come to know the owner, and he puts more attention in his members area than I would expect to see from any other site.

Not only does this next site give you an unconditional 1 year no risk money back guarantee, but it stands alone and it’s program is unmatched. Right now they’re doing a Free Trial period, and I’d take advantage of this while you can. The site reads "Learn the proven secrets for meeting, attracting, and seducing women. From A – Z, you’ll discover the most advanced techniques for picking up women ever developed." Check out their Free Trial (before it ends) and you’ll see why their members like this program so much.

NOT REVIEWED YET:

Here’s another one which I think has been reviewed here in the past but I haven’t gone through the old emails to check. Do You Want To Know A Simple, Two Minute Hypnotic Technique That Lets YOU Secretly Put Any Woman Into An Instant Trance And Persuades Her To Ask YOU Out?

Advanced Macking has one of the most enticing websites. An updated review would also be welcome.

This one also looked pretty interesting. Information on breakups and loving-styles.

Success Secrets Our free newsletter reveals it all Money and Personal Finance secrets; Business & Marketing secrets; Health, Fitness, and Weight-Loss advice; Self Defense secrets; Memory Improvement tips; Smart Advice on Flirting, Dating, Sex, and Relationships; Personal Development tips; Communication and Negotiation tips; Tax Secrets & Loopholes! Investment and Stock Market tips; and Much More

The Ultimate Guide to Powerful Relationships is only $8.95 and looks very interesting. Comments, please.

Plus! Free Survey Results of Women Using Personals for SexThe Guide contains the following Inside Secrets: Replying to ads – how to get noticed and get a date for hot sex.   Placing ads – how to beat the competition and get lots of replies How to handle follow up communication to keep her interested. Examples of replies that worked on us. You can just copy and paste these into your ads or replies. Saves you time and increases your chances! A directory of the best websites for meeting hot women! Sick of chicks who are only into cybersex and nothing else! The Guide contains a list of the best adult personals sites.

A course by Jian Wang to teach you how to write hypnotic language to make others obey your command.

Arte’s New Sex Video is kind of interesting. He shows a lot about playing with a woman’s g spot (which he demonstrates on his comely girlfriend – but I could have done without seeing your dick, Arte). I will do a more extensive review after I have watched it again more carefully.

Check this out.

cliff’s free plugs section
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up — from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):

 

[all words] [any words]

INFORMATION ABOUT THIS NEWSLETTER ARCHIVE:
This is an archive of a free e-mail list relating to seduction, maintained by "Clifford".  Your comments are requested, encouraged, and greatly appreciated (note that comments from different people are separated by IIIIIIII’s).  If you know anyone who would like to be added to the list, or if you would like to be removed from the list, send an e-mail asking to be added or removed to
cli***[email protected]***.com[ ? ] and it will be done.  If you would like to be added to the free joke list, just ask.  For those of you unfamiliar with the references to Speed Seduction»Â®, Clifford highly recommends your visiting http://www.seduction.com/.  For those interested in seeing the previous e-mails that were sent out ("the archives"), they are available on request to Clifford or, preferably, can be browsed and searched at the archive at http://www.fastseduction.com/cliff/.

By your accessing this archive, you understand that the information contained in within is an expression of opinions, and they should be used for personal entertainment purposes only.  You are responsible for your own behavior, and none of anything you read herein is to be considered legal or personal advice.  You also understand and agree that any products you may order as a result of your reading about them in this archive are produced and sold independently from us and that any complaints, disputes or other issues which you may have with the sponsors of these products are to be dealt with directly with said sponsors and we are not responsible in any way whatsoever for any issues which you may have with them.   If you are not in agreement with any of this, please leave his site now.

DISCLAIMERS:
This newsletter and the newsletter archive in general is reproduced here with Clifford’s permission.  Visual enhancements and search features have been added by the fastseduction.com webmaster to facilitate the reading and researching of the content.  The raw text as it appears here is exactly as it appeared in the original e-mail newsletter.  Products, services, or external web sites mentioned or linked to in this archive does not denote endorsement of those items.  The contents reprinted here are the opinion of the original writer(s) and are not necessarily the opinion of, nor endorsed by, the owner(s) or operator(s) of fastseduction.com.  The archive enhancements are generated automatically and there may be occasions where the visual cues don’t correlate exactly with the textual context; most of the time, though, the enhancements are pretty accurate.  The archive is updated as regularly as possible, whenever new newsletters are sent out.

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