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PU from an indirect, improvisational standpoint

mASF post by parkblvd

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PU from an indirect, improvisational standpoint
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mASF post by "parkblvd"
posted on: mASF forum: General Discussion newsgroup, June 6, 2005

(this is for newbs)

I was doing a bit of reading after last night (a few sets, nothing real), and
it hit me. From an indirect point of view, Mystery's whole A1-S3 stages are
nothing more than a slow, continuous amping up of value, BT, and DQing.

(Please, for the love of god, if you're into direct game, stop reading. I
*know* you can use implicit higher value and just go in. If she doesn't reject
you, then you can keep going, and you've started off with high value and gotten
past the DQ barrier. If she does reject you, there are other girls. But if
all of the girls around you have MUCH higher perceived value than you, you are
S.O.L. I mean, you can always set your standards lower... ;) )

If you game indirectly, then A1 is all about getting their attention, A2 is
about getting them interested, and A3 is about getting her to chase you. It's
the whole social hook point to attraction hook point. But many have advocated
negging right off the bat, or DQing immediately. All of Mystery's A1-A3 phases
are designed to get her BT up, your value up, and your DQ'ing of her up.

This is why swinggcat appeals to some, whereas DYD appeals to others. It's why
TD and Mystery are like the Sklanskys of the PU world. Because they all give
you advice helpful for a particular stage of value/BT/DQ. Most guys are at the
lowest end, and DYD gives you methods to start getting her BT up, but only a
few, and he shows you nothing about DQ. Swinggcat is a bit more thorough with
the whole system, but he's especially helpful when it comes to the DQ portion.
TD and Mystery have laid down the whole theory, and given WAY more than enough
advice to allow anyone who isn't psychotic to get through all of A1-A3. But
although the theory is solidly written, the examples are scattered all over the
place. Apparently, there's a book...

If you bomb on a girl, hard, it's usually because you either didn't have enough
value, or you didn't DQ her hard enough. You can always come in with more
value later (through social proof), or you can also reopen her with "I hate
you", which is really just the ultimate facetious DQ.

Value can be broken down into several categories. I stole much of this from
Style's whole attraction switches post, which was just brilliant.

emotion value:
the ability to cut her logic threads off and feed/lead her emotions
(this also means being in a good place, emotionally)
-making her laugh
-making her insecure
-etc (ANY emotion goes here - nervousness... overqualification... anger...

social value:
-self-confidence (ability to withstand social pressure)

something to offer:
adventure/fun value:
-role playing
information value (IIVDs):
-social observation
-Mystery's math and memorization tricks
light comfort value:
-lifestyle similarity

DQ value:
you don't acknowledge her value at all to start
you recognize her flaws
-her making you feel socially awkward
you recognize her strengths, but you reframe most of the strengths into flaws
you are non-needy (backturns)
you see strengths in others (iow you make her jealous by going up to other
---you have options and are hard to get (challenging)---
and at some point she starts chasing you, QUALIFYING herself like crazy
eventually, you like her for something that is NOT her body

and finally,
comfort value. But that's an entirely separate stage in which you have:
complexity (depth - never let her know ALL about you)
commonality (Style's list is culture, psychology, emotion, world-view, humor,
background, and current life)
understanding (both together are what I call "similar motivation structures")
safety (trust)
personal worth (ambition, morals lol, motivation, goals and dreams)

Many newbies don't want to go to bars and clubs because they don't feel that
they can display all of the value switches described above in that venue. They
feel more comfortable displaying them in venues in which they are already
successful (talented; valuable), dominant and comfortable. The problem with
this is that there are *generic* techniques for displaying dominance and value.
If you want to get REALLY good at this, you shouldn't exclude them from your
life. Also, staying inside your comfort zone is not the best place to be when
learning game...

(and btw - if you have a handicap and you're in a club, you MUST have something
going for you just to be there. A handicap can be a limp, much older age, or
an excessive display of weird clothing. Your clothing also reflects what kind
of person you are, so typically you want to dress like the prevailing culture
on crack. I desperately want a black t-shirt that says "SO Insecure". I'd
wear that shit on Long Island every single day.)

More on how to improvise:
I wrote a list up for myself on "how to improvise". It contains, in
programming language, every little thing I do in "spontaneous" conversation
that allows me to lead it. I'm posting part of it below. The other large part
of it I'm leaving out is all taken directly from Swinggcat's book. I really
really highly recommend his book - it's amazing. (for the record, I am NOT a

whatever you do, DON'T be emotionally affected by what she says
DLV (she made you sad or upset or hurt - so I say "I'm sorry" =( )
DHV stories
you/she/we shouldn't/can't do this
COMPLIMENT -> takeaway! (PULL-push) (can pull again light if push was harsh)
grade TWO style!

-responses to anything she says:
--dismissive (that's so cute)
--agreement with what she said (and elaboration/exaggeration)
--apologizing to what she said (DLV)
--WTF to what she said
--comment on her state
--find how what she says can help you (be my XXXXer)
--that's good, but for a useless random funny scenario
--bad (I don't like girls who are analagous to what she just said)
--fake pedestal (you're like the sun... with all these planets orbiting)

-cold read comments on her behaviour/motivation
-mocking/teasing her
-put words in her mouth
-that's a cute, adorable thing Satan likes

"WE" PULL (compliment her on your similarities)
->know what I like about you? your fashion. like the female version of me

dork<->jerk (DHV<->DLV - value adjustment!)
I'm just being social

-what to do if she tests you with a question:
(I had to delete all of this topic, as I got most of it straight from
Swinggcat, as opposed to the rest of this, which is all over mASF)

All right this is ass long and I should sleep. I wish that some really good
guy (like Style, or TD or whomever) would write his formulaic stuff for passing
C1-C3. But for now, this is how I frame A1-C1.


Unless otherwise noted, this article is Copyright©2005 by "parkblvd" with implicit permission provided to for reproduction. Any other use is prohibited without the explicit permission of the original author.


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